State of the Market

[ladymuck]

Those that can, do, and those that can't, manage.

[northernladuk]

Array

Those that can, do, and those that can't, manage.

Best way to get promoted. Be bad at what you do and a pain in the arse to manage.

[edison]

Those that can, do, and those that can't, manage.

Those that 'manage' get day rates of £800-1000+ so I'll live with not being able to 'do.'

The market for Heads of IT/IT Directors etc is usually a market in its own right. Over the last 4-6 weeks it has become red hot. I've got 9 or 10 opportunities on the go at the moment, 4 of which are Director or Head Of level. The one common theme is they are all moving slowly, but it bodes well for all you doers who will have something to do in a few months when us managers start, er, managing...

[GigiBronz]

Those that 'manage' get day rates of £800-1000+ so I'll live with not being able to 'do.'

The market for Heads of IT/IT Directors etc is usually a market in its own right. Over the last 4-6 weeks it has become red hot. I've got 9 or 10 opportunities on the go at the moment, 4 of which are Director or Head Of level. The one common theme is they are all moving slowly, but it bodes well for all you doers who will have something to do in a few months when us managers start, er, managing...

Satisfaction comes in different forms, sometimes a good balance of seeing an good engineering solution come out of your hands, learning interesting technologies, working with good people can be better than grudgingly chasing people with a stick all day long.
Also as a manager you can easily be shown the door, probably takes a bad meeting or a missed piece of information. Or just corporate politics.

In my experience, failed programmers end up on the bench and blame the world/conspiracy theories for that failure.

Mate, you are wasting your time, if you look at my posts you'd find that I say the same about myself.
But if you think that there are no things happening in the background you are a different type of naive...

[edison]

Those that can, do, and those that can't, manage.

Satisfaction comes in different forms, sometimes a good balance of seeing an good engineering solution come out of your hands, learning interesting technologies, working with good people can be better than grudgingly chasing people with a stick all day long.
Also as a manager you can easily be shown the door, probably takes a bad meeting or a missed piece of information. Or just corporate politics.

True, satisfaction comes in different forms. The last thing I'd do as a manager though is beat people with a stick or threaten to. I get most of my satisfaction at work through helping people and coaching and developing my team. Most good managers I know do the complete opposite of using a stick and in an increasingly remote working world, threats and coercion are less likely to succeed.

If you're leading the IT function (or any function) then you're unlikely to be fired just like that for a bad meeting or some missing info. It would need gross negligence and it happens rarely in the real world.

[ladymuck]

Those that 'manage' get day rates of £800-1000+ so I'll live with not being able to 'do.'

The market for Heads of IT/IT Directors etc is usually a market in its own right. Over the last 4-6 weeks it has become red hot. I've got 9 or 10 opportunities on the go at the moment, 4 of which are Director or Head Of level. The one common theme is they are all moving slowly, but it bodes well for all you doers who will have something to do in a few months when us managers start, er, managing...

I can't manage my way out of a wet paper bag and like hiding in my dark cupboard away from all that crud which managers have to deal with.

[GigiBronz]

I can't manage my way out of a wet paper bag and like hiding in my dark cupboard away from all that crud which managers have to deal with.

Takes a bit of time to learn that being a contractor is about proving value. That might sound like a cliche but I truly believe that is what it is all about.

everyone around here that has been through failure, difficult projects, tight deadlines, disgruntled clients. And that is fine, that is where experience lies, how you react to them. Every situation in itself is a lesson. When you are a permi, you can just shut yourself off, and ignore everything, but as a contractor you have to know what you have to brinng to the table otherwise you are out before the weekend. And a lot of times that is the best motivator.

The more people stand for themselves the more people will acknowledge the value this odd type of people have to bring. Most of hiring managers only understand control, and pretty much everythinf about hiring a resource is about that, to my disgust. Can’t blame them, everyone wants an easy life and minions running around them.

so let’s all do our part, whether we are in a contract or not, we want outside contracts, decent rates and better terms.

the nonsense played last time about “only the good people get outside” is pointless, I think we’ve all learned by now that the success of it lies in the numbers, not in the quality of few odd people out there. Market would have been stronger with permtractors at lower rates and true contractors and decent rates and all outside.

Climbing corporate ladder is a mith anyway… let’s not forget that

[Bluenose]

Those that 'manage' get day rates of £800-1000+ so I'll live with not being able to 'do.'

The market for Heads of IT/IT Directors etc is usually a market in its own right. Over the last 4-6 weeks it has become red hot. I've got 9 or 10 opportunities on the go at the moment, 4 of which are Director or Head Of level. The one common theme is they are all moving slowly, but it bodes well for all you doers who will have something to do in a few months when us managers start, er, managing...

Its a troll post but i will point out to lesser experienced readers of this post that said wide-boys have been eating dry porridge, water and driving ubers for almost two years waiting for the market to turn.

[_V_]

Those that can, do, and those that can't, manage. Those that can't manage, get a senior job in the public sector.

FTFY

[eek]

Takes a bit of time to learn that being a contractor is about proving value. That might sound like a cliche but I truly believe that is what it is all about.

everyone around here that has been through failure, difficult projects, tight deadlines, disgruntled clients. And that is fine, that is where experience lies, how you react to them. Every situation in itself is a lesson. When you are a permi, you can just shut yourself off, and ignore everything, but as a contractor you have to know what you have to brinng to the table otherwise you are out before the weekend. And a lot of times that is the best motivator.

The more people stand for themselves the more people will acknowledge the value this odd type of people have to bring. Most of hiring managers only understand control, and pretty much everythinf about hiring a resource is about that, to my disgust. Can’t blame them, everyone wants an easy life and minions running around them.

so let’s all do our part, whether we are in a contract or not, we want outside contracts, decent rates and better terms.

the nonsense played last time about “only the good people get outside” is pointless, I think we’ve all learned by now that the success of it lies in the numbers, not in the quality of few odd people out there. Market would have been stronger with permtractors at lower rates and true contractors and decent rates and all outside.

Climbing corporate ladder is a mith anyway… let’s not forget that

Which shows how little you understand about IR35.

The issue is that the requirements that ensure you safely outside IR35 are the very opposite of what a highly skilled specialist offers.