being paid less than permanent staff! What would you do?

[AMH]

Are you a sockie? Seriously, you've been at the same client for 4 years? If you don't understand AWR (and good luck with a tribunal BTW) did you ever get your contract reviewed with regard to IR35? Do your working practices mirror the permies, or do you operate as a real business?

Why does it matter what the permies are on? Presumably you took the rate because it was acceptable to you. Jealousy is not a good way to approach the situation. As others have said, there's not a great deal you can do until renewal time when you can say, "I want £x....." and then shut up and wait for their counter offer, which may of course be, "Ok. Bye then."

Nope, I have never had my contracts reviewed for IR35 as I believe I am in scope.
Yes, my work practice mirrors permies
I believe I am in IR35 scope & have always operated my business that way - im only slightly better off being LTD than an umbrella, to give you an idea of the rate I am on.
It matters because if I am doing the same job, with the same responsibilities, then I should be paid equal. Not 30-40% less.
I got confirmation with the agency that I have not signed a AWR waiver.

Last year, the whole IT department got outsourced to a manage service company - so it is only recently the difference in salary has come to my attention & I don't feel valued.

As for being happy to accept the original rate, I was - because I was out of work for 18 months recovering from a serious accident. Hence my skill set fell behind. I am trying to train atm via books & nuggets to get my skills back to being current.

[SpontaneousOrder]

This whole AWR tribunal thing, given the context you've outlined, sounds like the kind of thing that gives the rest of us a bad name.

[TheFaQQer]

Nope, I have never had my contracts reviewed for IR35 as I believe I am in scope.
Yes, my work practice mirrors permies
I believe I am in IR35 scope & have always operated my business that way - im only slightly better off being LTD than an umbrella, to give you an idea of the rate I am on.
It matters because if I am doing the same job, with the same responsibilities, then I should be paid equal. Not 30-40% less.
I got confirmation with the agency that I have not signed a AWR waiver.

Last year, the whole IT department got outsourced to a manage service company - so it is only recently the difference in salary has come to my attention & I don't feel valued.

As for being happy to accept the original rate, I was - because I was out of work for 18 months recovering from a serious accident. Hence my skill set fell behind. I am trying to train atm via books & nuggets to get my skills back to being current.

Your best move would be into another role that is not caught by IR35, although if you want to be valued then I'd dust off the CV and look for a permanent role elsewhere (since one isn't available at your current employer).

You've been there four years now - if you haven't managed to get your skills up to date in that time, then I'd look at a decent permie job for a year or so to get the skills back, and then try again when you have brought them up to date.

Good luck.

[AMH]

Your best move would be into another role that is not caught by IR35, although if you want to be valued then I'd dust off the CV and look for a permanent role elsewhere (since one isn't available at your current employer).

You've been there four years now - if you haven't managed to get your skills up to date in that time, then I'd look at a decent permie job for a year or so to get the skills back, and then try again when you have brought them up to date.

Good luck.

part of the problem of getting outsourced... it became a dead end job. Not even the permmies have anyway to progress in the company.
As for looking for a permmy job (or another contract) - i live in the middle of nowhere - so roles are hard to come by. I am not in the situation where I can move because of my partners job.

[TheFaQQer]

part of the problem of getting outsourced... it became a dead end job. Not even the permmies have anyway to progress in the company.
As for looking for a permmy job (or another contract) - i live in the middle of nowhere - so roles are hard to come by. I am not in the situation where I can move because of my partners job.

So if the client turn around today and say "that's it, no more contract, you're out the door on Friday" what would you do?

And if you start bleating to them about how you need a 30-40% increase to match their permanent staff, then I wouldn't be too surprised if that's what they said. The great thing about running your own business is that you can choose who you work for, when you work, and where you do it - I suggest that you start thinking about that and consider what your options are from here.

[b0redom]

Nope, I have never had my contracts reviewed for IR35 as I believe I am in scope.
It matters because if I am doing the same job, with the same responsibilities, then I should be paid equal. Not 30-40% less.

Sorry to be harsh, but why? If I can get one subcontractor for half the price I can pay my staff, why wouldn't I?

I got confirmation with the agency that I have not signed a AWR waiver.

So? Makes no odds to your billable rate etc

Last year, the whole IT department got outsourced to a manage service company - so it is only recently the difference in salary has come to my attention & I don't feel valued.

As for being happy to accept the original rate, I was - because I was out of work for 18 months recovering from a serious accident. Hence my skill set fell behind. I am trying to train atm via books & nuggets to get my skills back to being current.

Sorry, but again makes no odds. You either need to skill up and/or move or suck it up.

[AMH]

well its in the agency hands now. I do have high level security clearances.
So up to the client to find someone as cheap as me to replace me with the relevant clearances needed.
Or pay more either to myself or someone else.

[b0redom]

well its in the agency hands now. I do have high level security clearances.

Then you shouldn't be really revealing that on a public Internet forum should you?

So up to the client to find someone as cheap as me to replace me with the relevant clearances needed.
Or pay more either to myself or someone else.

I'm pretty sure you're a sockie, but if you're not, you need to ask yourself (as someone previously said), if the client turns around tomorrow and says, "Enough. You're fired." What will you do? You know you have no employment rights as a contractor right? You can't sue for anything. My other half works in the area, isn't really a decent fall back position.

[TykeMerc]

Quite a silly thread with limited credibility, the sock drawer is a reasonable place for the origin of the thread starter, but that's the case for most of these silly threads.

As everyone else has said, there are a few very obvious options.

1. Tell them they don't pay enough and to shove it
2. Tell them they don't pay enough, it's 50% rate increase or "you" will leave and mean it
3. Stick with it and stop moaning

Hire a lawyer and fight it, but be sure of the rights "you" want to claim.

Oh and revealing you have clearance is grounds for that clearance to be revoked.