No deal better than a bad deal

[Whorty]

Just wanted to see whether you'd double down on what some posters on here call dishonestly engaging...

You're the one posting the 1/42 figure - do you not think YOU should have researched the stats behind it?

Here's the years he was on the committee;
2002, 2004, 2007, 2009, 2012, 2013

Here's the years that were selected, to make that 'statistic';
2010, 2011, 2012

Can you spot the difference?

Do you reckon they were using selective dates, to get a headline? Answers on a postcard please...

PS. "The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results”.

The research of 1/42 was carried out by Greenpeace. If you don't agree with that widely accepted research feel free to post up your own research on what you think the real number is.

BTW, Greenpeace quote : “over the three years that Nigel Farage was a member of the European Parliament Fisheries Committee, he attended one out of 42 meetings”.

Whatever years they chose, they quote them as years that Farage was a member of the EPF and hence would be expected to turn up, debate and vote.

Go on fella, give us your 'facts'.

[Bean]

You keep repeating 1/42 - you've made the claim probably more often than anyone else on here.
So, tell me, on all the meetings when he was on the committee,
1. How often did he attend the debates?
2. How often did he take part in them in a constructive way?
3. How often did he vote?
4. How often did the vote result end up different to how he voted?

According to the figures you quote, on at least 41 occasions he did not attend/debate/vote, so that's 41 times where he can say what he likes, but he didn't vote, therefore he failed in his opportunity to represent the UK.

Gosh, you seem to be asking a lot of questions without answering mine.

Perhaps I shall give you the same courtesy and not answer them?

1. How many meetings did the committee hold, whilst he was a member?
2. Define constructive, given outvoting...
3. Do you mean Nigel and/or his substitute voter, or solely Nigel?
4. Your assertion in bold is not correct, (see Q3 and link/quote below)

"When Mr. Farage cannot attend a fisheries committee meeting there is always a substitute member who takes his place. So the vote we are given on the committee is used by a nominated substitute and not wasted."
News and Media - Nigel Farage MEP

HTH BIDI

[Bean]

The research of 1/42 was carried out by Greenpeace. If you don't agree with that widely accepted research feel free to post up your own research on what you think the real number is.

BTW, Greenpeace quote : “over the three years that Nigel Farage was a member of the European Parliament Fisheries Committee, he attended one out of 42 meetings”.

Whatever years they chose, they quote them as years that Farage was a member of the EPF and hence would be expected to turn up, debate and vote.

Go on fella, give us your 'facts'.

He was a member of the committee for longer than 2010-2012. That's a matter of fact, according to websites run on behalf of the EU.

As I posted to meridian;

Here's the years he was on the committee;
2002, 2004, 2007, 2009, 2012, 2013

Here's the years that were selected, to make that 'statistic';
2010, 2011, 2012

Can you spot the difference?

So yeah, maybe selectively on those 3 years, Greenpeace are correct - but it is completely disingenuous of them to suggest that is the sum total of his contributions to the committee, or do you disagree?

[darmstadt]

No. He is elected to represent his constituents.

Big old constituency he has, the South East of England which is the counties of Berkshire, Buckinghamshire, East Sussex, Hampshire, the Isle of Wight, Kent, Oxfordshire, Surrey and West Sussex. There are also 3 other MEPs for that area who are also UKIP (unless they've also resigned.) Wonder what their voting record is like?

It was interesting to note that Farage, among others, were vocal in stating that the MPs who created this 'Independent Group' should all stand for re-election yet he didn't consider if for himself after resigning from UKIP.

[WTFH]

Gosh, you seem to be asking a lot of questions without answering mine.

Perhaps I shall give you the same courtesy and not answer them?

1. How many meetings did the committee hold, whilst he was a member?
2. Define constructive, given outvoting...
3. Do you mean Nigel and/or his substitute voter, or solely Nigel?
4. Your assertion in bold is not correct, (see Q3 and link/quote below)

"When Mr. Farage cannot attend a fisheries committee meeting there is always a substitute member who takes his place. So the vote we are given on the committee is used by a nominated substitute and not wasted."
News and Media - Nigel Farage MEP

HTH BIDI

I shall struggle to give answers that you will find acceptable.
If he failed to attend for fear of being outvoted (a term you have used several times), then how does sending a substitute allay his fears or provide a better solution? The reason given (outvoting) does not match the story of sending a substitute.


I'll define constructive as:
1. Directly relating to what is being discussed
2. Showing the ability to listen and empathise with others
3. Considering others on the committee to have a right to be heard and a right to have a different opinion.
4. Able to discuss the merits and failings of suggestions without ruling them out because of where they came from
5. Working towards a mutual agreement that is in the best interest of those directly affected, and not just to create media attention or further the career/popularity/income of the speaker.

[WTFH]

Who said this:

after we leave on March 29, have ... no tariffs, no quotas, no restrictions of any kind, no problems or difficulties with Ireland whatsoever

[Old Greg]

Who said this:

The tooth fairy.

[Whorty]

He was a member of the committee for longer than 2010-2012. That's a matter of fact, according to websites run on behalf of the EU.

As I posted to meridian;


So yeah, maybe selectively on those 3 years, Greenpeace are correct - but it is completely disingenuous of them to suggest that is the sum total of his contributions to the committee, or do you disagree?

I'm not convinced you're correct. Greenpeace said the 3 years that he was a member. You claim they are talking abou 2010 - 2012, then in your post you claim he wasn't a member during 2 of those years. You see where the issue is? The Greenpeace research is widely accepted as correct, so Farage should have attended 42 mtgs but only attended 1.

Now it is quite probably that others years outside these 3 he attended more meetings, but I don't have those stats, and clearly neither do you else you would have posted them.

Unless you can prove otherwise then, during three years he should have attended 42 meetings but only attended 1. This is not good given he is supposed to be the fisherman's friend

[Bean]

I shall struggle to give answers that you will find acceptable.
If he failed to attend for fear of being outvoted (a term you have used several times), then how does sending a substitute allay his fears or provide a better solution? The reason given (outvoting) does not match the story of sending a substitute.

Think you're conflating 'never votes' with 'sometimes doesn't vote' for a start..

I'm sure after the Greenpeace 'research', he made adjustments, to allay those who voiced concerns (like you) that he was 'failing to represent etc etc', so now a vote can take place using a substitute and he can save his time by not attending personally.

HTH

I'll define constructive as:
1. Directly relating to what is being discussed
2. Showing the ability to listen and empathise with others
3. Considering others on the committee to have a right to be heard and a right to have a different opinion.
4. Able to discuss the merits and failings of suggestions without ruling them out because of where they came from
5. Working towards a mutual agreement that is in the best interest of those directly affected, and not just to create media attention or further the career/popularity/income of the speaker.

Not quite what a quick google search of the word 'constructive' returns but hey ho.

Addressing Q1, Q2, Q4 & Q5 (Not committee, EP) but still...

Here's a some contributions on Fishing to the EP, Oct 2003;
Debates - Wednesday, 8 October 2003 - Fisheries partnership agreements with third countries
and another, Jan 2003
Debates - Thursday, 16 January 2003 - Fishing in international waters
and another, Nov 2002
Debates - Monday, 18 November 2002 - Common fisheries policy (CFP)
and another, May 2002
Debates - Wednesday, 29 May 2002 - Common fisheries policy


So;
1. How many meetings did the committee hold, whilst he was a member?
3. Do you mean Nigel and/or his substitute voter, or solely Nigel?


PS. The right to have a different opinion is not the same as a right to force people to listen to your opinion, besides their opinions are recorded in the EU equivalent of Hansard aren't they?

[Bean]

I'm not convinced you're correct. Greenpeace said the 3 years that he was a member. You claim they are talking abou 2010 - 2012, then in your post you claim he wasn't a member during 2 of those years. You see where the issue is? The Greenpeace research is widely accepted as correct, so Farage should have attended 42 mtgs but only attended 1.

Now it is quite probably that others years outside these 3 he attended more meetings, but I don't have those stats, and clearly neither do you else you would have posted them.

Unless you can prove otherwise then, during three years he should have attended 42 meetings but only attended 1. This is not good given he is supposed to be the fisherman's friend

You're right, I missed those 2 years, so below is the complete list of ALL dates, so far...

21-07-1999 / 14-01-2002 : Committee on Fisheries
17-01-2002 / 19-07-2004 : Committee on Fisheries
21-07-2004 / 14-01-2007 : Committee on Fisheries
15-01-2007 / 30-01-2007 : Committee on Fisheries
07-01-2009 / 13-07-2009 : Committee on Fisheries
16-07-2009 / 18-01-2012 : Committee on Fisheries <- Here is the extremely selective dates used by Greenpeace
19-01-2012 / 13-01-2013 : Committee on Fisheries

Source: Home | Nigel FARAGE | MEPs | European Parliament

Of course, Europa.eu could be lying
Pop goes your bubble, just like meridian.

So let's ask you again - do you feel Greenpeace are being dishonest (in their very selective use of dates) ?