Corbyn proposes a second referendum

[vetran]

You say Whorty's analogy is 'rowlocks' then you come out with that steaming load of tulipe. You are a complete tit

I was working with warthogs poor start, it was a stretch.

I see you can't understand how I wove the truth into my analogy, you just had pizza. sorry its not as easy just do what mother EU wants.

[Old Greg]

I was working with warthogs poor start, it was a stretch.

I see you can't understand how I wove the truth into my analogy, you just had pizza. sorry its not as easy just do what mother EU wants.

The power of shandy.

[vetran]

The power of shandy.

obviously half a pint affects your powers of comprehension.

[TestMangler]

obviously half a pint affects your powers of comprehension.

No, I think the problem is that you talk some amount of tulipe.

[vetran]

No, I think the problem is that you talk some amount of tulipe.

in YOUR opinion.

[Yorkie62]

OK, think about it this way then ....

You're at home with the wife and 3 kids. You ask everyone if they want you to cook tonight, as normal, or have a takeaway.

You and the wife want you to cook.

The 3 kids want takeaway, so takeaway wins (get over it, you lost)

Problem is, the 3 kids can't agree on the takeaway they want. One wants Chinese, one wants Indian, one wants pizza.

After a few tantrums you and the wife step in and try to negotiate with the kids to choose one option. One kid backs down and says they'll change from pizza to Indian. The kid that wants Chinese hates curries, and sticks to wanting a chinese.

You say, ok guys. The question is now, do you want me to cook or do you want an Indian.

This is a different question. The kid that doesn't want Indian now chooses home cooked food instead.

If it was the same question kid 3 would have chosen takeaway again. It's now a different question and she chooses home cooked, something she rejected before she had the detailed information on what 'takeaway' meant.

Does this help, or do you need an adult to explain this to you?

It is still asking a binary question if you want a specific takeaway or home cooked food. By doing this you are disenfranchising those that either don't like, or can't for medical reasons have an Indian. Their option, assuming they want a takeaway is to abstain. Not very democratic it is.

If you want to go down that route then you have to put every flavour of takeaway out there in order to be truly democratic.

Therefore you need a ballot paper that covers every flavour of Brexit
May' deal
Norway
Norway+
Norway++
Canada
Canada+
Canada++
No deal
Remain
And possibly a few other we haven't thought of yet.

This is the only truly democratic format for a 2nd referendum. If you want a 2nd referendum then lets have a democratic one or just go back to the binary IN/OUT with no specifics on either choice.

[Zigenare]

If there is a 2nd ref, it shouldn't be the same question as 2016 (in or out). By now we should know what 'out' looks like so if there is a 2nd ref it should be ...

Do you want to leave the EU with the agreed deal or/

Do you want to remain in the EU

In 2016 we were offered unicorns and Narnia and what people voted for was a vision of 'out' that was not available. Now we know what is on offer the 2nd ref should be that.

I know Brexiters don't want these options as they know that staying in is better than any deal will ever be and they will lose, but surely that would be the whole point of a 2nd ref, to get the public a final say? If Brexiters aren't convinced by the final deal then doesn't that tell you that staying in is better than leaving?

Come on boys, let's have some bedwetting, you lost suck it up blah blah blah comments now. Attack me rather than try to sell your vision of brexit

The referendum in 2016 was about leaving. It had nothing whatsoever to do with a deal.

We're leaving, how we leave is a different question altogether.

[WTFH]

The referendum in 2016 was about leaving. It had nothing whatsoever to do with a deal.

We're leaving, how we leave is a different question altogether.

I totally agree. A narrow majority of those who voted said they wanted to leave.

The vote didn’t say “Should we have a hard border in Ireland?”
The Leave spin was to ignore the Irish border altogether, after all, they didn’t say “Take back control of our borders” did they? :

Border checkpoints can be put around the UK, and it appears that the English are keen to have them at Dover, Folkestone, Ramsgate :lol: , etc. So, where are the English Leavers when it comes to putting border checkpoints in Ireland?

Until the Leave camp come up with an agreement between themselves of what “leave” means, then they’ve got no one but themselves to blame. It’s not remainers fault, it’s not the EU’s fault.

If the decision is to leave, then is it to break all ties, kick out all EU nationals, all EU businesses and groups, remove all UK businesses from the EU and, in effect, build a wall around the UK, or is the pogrom not to be as severe as that?
The Leave camp do not have a united front, do not have a united message, and when challenged, do not have any details or plans for how they intend to get a united message and plans, never mind how they plan to implement them.

[darmstadt]

If the decision is to leave, then is it to break all ties, kick out all EU nationals, all EU businesses and groups, remove all UK businesses from the EU and, in effect, build a wall around the UK, or is the pogrom not to be as severe as that?
The Leave camp do not have a united front, do not have a united message, and when challenged, do not have any details or plans for how they intend to get a united message and plans, never mind how they plan to implement them.

This bit. They voted Leave, so that means Leave. Hard borders, all trade deals have to be renegotiated, in fact everything that has come about because the UK is a member of the EU to be rescinded. It would be chaos compared to the absolute shambles that is now happening.

[meridian]

The referendum in 2016 was about leaving. It had nothing whatsoever to do with a deal.

Gaslighting and revisionism. That wasn't how the Leave campaign sold the referendum to the public.

Slide 11.

Why_Vote_Leave.pdf

There is a free trade zone from Iceland to Turkey and the Russian border and we will be part of it

Taking back control is a careful change, not a sudden stop - we will negotiate the terms of a new deal before we start any legal process to leave