Farmers clutching at straws

[sasguru]

It's funny because those who voted remain did so for reasons such as

I want to work in the EU with no barriers
I am not affected by refugees so let more in
I want to be part of Europe


where as brexiters are more like

We do not believe being part of the EU is a benefit to the majority of people in the UK
We believe the UK can do better outside of the EU for the majority of people in the UK



We are almost using the same arguments to support different sides - except for 1 small difference.

The problem is you're a cretinous simpleton, making simplistic assumptions.

Just to give one example, you do realise that disengaging completely from Europe is contrary to at least 400 years of British foreign policy?
And for another, you do realise that one of the biggest architects and fans of the single market was Maggie Thatcher?

Here's her speech:

Speech opening Single Market Campaign | Margaret Thatcher Foundation

[WTFH]

It's funny because those who voted remain did so for reasons such as

I want to work in the EU with no barriers
I am not affected by refugees so let more in
I want to be part of Europe

Are you sure you're not just putting words into peoples mouths. It's almost like you've quoted veteran, who claimed that the BBC and the Guardian had run headlines which stated that, but could never find a link, apart from ones to Daily Wail made up stories.

Brexiters like to claim that those who wanted to stay in the EU did so because they believe we should have more refugees in this country.
In the same way that Brexiters like to claim is it the EU that is taking away the UK's sovereignty.
The UK government is lazy, selfish and pathetic. Rather than doing, they prefer blaming as it's easier.

Want to reduce immigration? Why not tighten the rules to enter the UK, and spend more on the UK border force? No, instead let's blame the EU and spend less on the UKBF.
Want to prevent health tourism in the UK? Why not use similar rules to those in other EU countries? No, instead let's blame the EU.
Want to come up with a plan for Brexit that unites the country? No, let's blame those who don't support Brexit for not being on board and let's blame the EU.

[Paddy]

It's funny because those who voted remain did so for reasons such as

I want to work in the EU with no barriers
I am not affected by refugees so let more in
I want to be part of Europe


where as brexiters are more like

We do not believe being part of the EU is a benefit to the majority of people in the UK
We believe the UK can do better outside of the EU for the majority of people in the UK



We are almost using the same arguments to support different sides - except for 1 small difference.

"I want to work in the EU with no barriers" Plus retirement in the EU, ease of doing business with the EU.
"I am not affected by refugees so let more in" Absolute bollox, I am totally against the refugee policy, Hungary and Czech are also against the policy but they firmly stated that they will remain in the EU. The UK should be leading in the EU rather that sulking in the back. Moreover, the UK could have stopped unnecessary EU immigration if they implemented the rules; not only they chose not to do so but also Blair invited the Poles into the UK before they qualified to do so.
"I want to be part of Europe" I don't want to rely on the dream of the British Empire v2


"where as brexiters are more like" ... the thicko's of society. e.g. I was talking to a Brexiter last weekend and he though the EU was NATO! Nearly every Indian I have spoken with had voted for Brexit because they believe it would e easier to bring their extended family into the UK...

[Cirrus]

Soundbites don't pay the mortgage

where as brexiters are more like

We do not believe being part of the EU is a benefit to the majority of people in the UK
We believe the UK can do better outside of the EU for the majority of people in the UK

Well that's absolutely spot on.

And we Remainers would totally support you.

Apart from one minor issue: you haven't got a scintilla of logical thought, evidence or concrete proposal about either of those fancy statements. We're all ears - just throw us a few crumbs: suggest anything whatsoever that will improve the lot of normal people when we leave the EU.

Anything you like. But please - something concrete and not endless abstract nouns and vacuous soundbites.

[original PM]

"I want to work in the EU with no barriers" Plus retirement in the EU, ease of doing business with the EU.
"I am not affected by refugees so let more in" Absolute bollox, I am totally against the refugee policy, Hungary and Czech are also against the policy but they firmly stated that they will remain in the EU. The UK should be leading in the EU rather that sulking in the back. Moreover, the UK could have stopped unnecessary EU immigration if they implemented the rules; not only they chose not to do so but also Blair invited the Poles into the UK before they qualified to do so.
"I want to be part of Europe" I don't want to rely on the dream of the British Empire v2


"where as brexiters are more like" ... the thicko's of society. e.g. I was talking to a Brexiter last weekend and he though the EU was NATO! Nearly every Indian I have spoken with had voted for Brexit because they believe it would e easier to bring their extended family into the UK...

Nobody said you could not retire in the EU after brexit - as long as you have the money
Nobody said you could not trade with the EU after brexit - no idea where that came from

If the refugee policy does not change how long will it be before those countries do leave the EU?

Will these countries who currently get a return of 3/4 times the money they contribute to the EU still back the EU when they get less out than they put in?

We tried to lead, we tried to make changes - the EU told us to fook off.

Empire V2 - :sigh: really when did anyone say that?

1 Brexiter != every brexiter

How many Indians have you spoken to - how many Indians live in the UK? -

[original PM]

The problem is you're a cretinous simpleton, making simplistic assumptions.

Just to give one example, you do realise that disengaging completely from Europe is contrary to at least 400 years of British foreign policy?
And for another, you do realise that one of the biggest architects and fans of the single market was Maggie Thatcher?

Here's her speech:

Speech opening Single Market Campaign | Margaret Thatcher Foundation

Yes and you know what

• -€3.6bn in rebates negotiated by Margaret Thatcher in 1984, called the 'UK correction' in the official data. This is paid for by other EU member states. Mostly France, which pays €965.9bn towards our rebate

The rebate we get has not changed in 34 years.

Although this is copied from the BBC website so you can see the deliberate mistake I guess?

[Paddy]

Nobody said you could not retire in the EU after brexit - as long as you have the money
Nobody said you could not trade with the EU after brexit - no idea where that came from

If the refugee policy does not change how long will it be before those countries do leave the EU?

Will these countries who currently get a return of 3/4 times the money they contribute to the EU still back the EU when they get less out than they put in?

We tried to lead, we tried to make changes - the EU told us to fook off.

Empire V2 - :sigh: really when did anyone say that?

1 Brexiter != every brexiter

How many Indians have you spoken to - how many Indians live in the UK? -

Bollox to your other answers but for "How many Indians have you spoken to - how many Indians live in the UK?"

When in the UK I speak with Indians on a near daily basis. Strangely, those with business have all voted Remain, those without businesses consistently voted leave for the reason given. Furthermore, the BBC interviewed the Indian community in Birmingham and they had the same results and answers. Moreover there was a programme on BBC R4 at the weekend interviewing Pro-Brexit and Remain MP's.; guess what, the Brexit MP's were selling the idea of what a wonderful opportunity Brixit will bring for Indians to bring their extended families to the UK.

[original PM]

Bollox to your other answers but for "How many Indians have you spoken to - how many Indians live in the UK?"

When in the UK I speak with Indians on a near daily basis. Strangely, those with business have all voted Remain, those without businesses consistently voted leave for the reason given. Furthermore, the BBC interviewed the Indian community in Birmingham and they had the same results and answers. Moreover there was a programme on BBC R4 at the weekend interviewing Pro-Brexit and Remain MP's.; guess what, the Brexit MP's were selling the idea of what a wonderful opportunity Brixit will bring for Indians to bring their extended families to the UK.

Strange that those that own business and therefore want cheaper labour are in favour of being in the EU and the associated immigration that comes with it..... although just to caveat we know the UK could control it - but we know the UK does not and blames the EU.

Again those people who own business are not seeing what would be best for the UK as a whole but what would be best for them regardless of the impact on the rest of the UK.

[vetran]

The problem is you're a cretinous simpleton, making simplistic assumptions.

Just to give one example, you do realise that disengaging completely from Europe is contrary to at least 400 years of British foreign policy?
And for another, you do realise that one of the biggest architects and fans of the single market was Maggie Thatcher?

Here's her speech:

Speech opening Single Market Campaign | Margaret Thatcher Foundation

Strange you believe that speech supports the EU as it is now and its goals going forward. What do you expect from AssGoo the cretin moron general.

She bemoans the lack of progress since 1973 because of hidden barriers put up by our 'partners'.

You might say: weren't we supposed to have a common market already? Wasn't that the reason we joined Europe in the first place? [end p6] Weren't we promised all this in 1973?It's a fair question to ask. And the truthful answer is: Europe wasn't open for business. Underneath the rhetoric, the old barriers remained. Not just against the outside world, but between the European countries. [end p7]
Not the classic barriers of tariffs, but the insiduous ones of differing national standards, various restrictions on the provision of services, exclusion of foreign firms from public contracts.

Strangely no mention of an EU army, Political wing or an Asylum policy.


You realise that allowing France & Germany to rule Europe is against millennia of British foreign policy?

[Cirrus]

the UK is leaving the EU and sitting there moaning about it and not looking to the future is the almost exact definition of sticking your head in the sand.

The Government, and the Opposition are still pushing Remain over Brexit (they don't call it Remain but it's obvious to everybody that Chequers drifts to BRINO, drifts to Norway).

Ask me about moaning when we've left. Right now I'm still in the fight to kill this thing off as far as we can.