A Brexit Thread from Someone who Didn't Vote

[northernladyuk]

Another referendum for what? The citizens expressed the will to leave the EU, so let them leave.

Did they express a will to leave the custom's union? Or the single market? Or the ECHR? Or the free movement of labour area? There was no mandate for any of that.

[Mordac]

Do you understand what multiple contributing factors are, or indeed anything about cause and effect?

Your analysis appears to state that if weak sterling was a contributing factor to the collapse of Monarch, then all other UK airlines would have collapsed. Even for a Brexit cretin like you, this is very weak stuff indeed. I don't shock easily anymore, but really!

How is this "weak"? OP stated that Monarch failed due to Brexit, I think we're all fairly agreed it didn't. It failed due to management stupidity, compounded by many factors including a fall in the £. Two European airlines have gone bust in the last few months, I'm guessing that somewhere in your little mind Brexit is to blame for those as well...

[Mordac]

Did they express a will to leave the custom's union? Or the single market? Or the ECHR? Or the free movement of labour area? There was no mandate for any of that.

"Leaving the EU" means "leaving the EU". All of it. The end.

[Bean]

The only reason for not having a second referendum is that you are afraid to let the people have a direct say.

Meh, makes almost zero difference to me tbh - should just be funny what 'facts' come out about the deal before any potential vote, given the level of 'facts' on both sides before the 1st ref

[northernladyuk]

So was the collapse of Monarch nothing to do with an increased cost base, resulting from weak sterling?



http://www.theguardian.com/business/...apse-explainer

If you dispute the Guardian analysis, please offer your own.

If the Graun is correct, why haven't all UK airlines gone tits up? An increase of £50m due to the fall in sterling (which sounds reasonably accurate) should be easily affordable, and most airlines hedge USD rates anyway. It's the £3bn for the new planes which pushed them over the edge, they should have waited until they had a stable business - Easyjet & Ryanair have been doing this (mostly brilliantly) for years, and Monarch thought they could just wander into the market and carry on as normal? As I said, it was poor management and greedy owners. Monarch was in trouble 3 years ago, well before anyone was even dreaming about Brexit. The loss of some of its routes in Tunisia and Egypt won't have helped, and they should have been thinking about consolidating, not expanding.
The Graun analysis is lazy and predictable, blame Brexit for everything and don't bother looking anywhere else.

Do you understand what multiple contributing factors are, or indeed anything about cause and effect?

Your analysis appears to state that if weak sterling was a contributing factor to the collapse of Monarch, then all other UK airlines would have collapsed. Even for a Brexit cretin like you, this is very weak stuff indeed. I don't shock easily anymore, but really!

How is this "weak"? OP stated that Monarch failed due to Brexit, I think we're all fairly agreed it didn't. It failed due to management stupidity, compounded by many factors including a fall in the £. Two European airlines have gone bust in the last few months, I'm guessing that somewhere in your little mind Brexit is to blame for those as well...

Christ on a bike, you can't even follow a conversational thread!

You stated:

If the Graun is correct, why haven't all UK airlines gone tits up

The Guardian stated weak sterling as one of multiple contributing factors. Why would weak sterling make all UK airlines go bust when they lack the other contributing factors?

[motoukenin]

I'll keep this concise; we need a second referendum. Monarch is the first major business casualty to come as a result of Brexit, due to an extremely weak pound.

July 19th 2015 the £ vs the Euro was 1.44
August 25th 2017, it's 1.077.
Prior to Brexit the £ was at its weakest in 2013, and even then it was at 1.13.

Why do we need another chance to vote? The turnout was 72%. I didn't vote because frankly, neither side used any FACTUAL information when presenting their argument. No-one actually knew what it meant so honestly, how on earth can you cast a vote? At least when you vote for a party they have a manifesto (not that it is ever stuck to) so you can get at least an idea of what the horizon may look like in a few years time. I am almost certain there were a large number of people who also didn't vote based on this total lack of information or frank dishonesty from both sides.

Oh - and then there was the fact people voted for David Cameron steering us out of the EU - someone who was actually relatively capable, but oh no wait - another lie - he resigned. Whatever happened to "I'll see this through no matter the result!" - the whole thing has been a sham

Brexit voters I really really hope your immigration policies (which won't happen by the way) and "sovereignty" were worth it.

God help us of Corbyn offers us a glimmer of hope to go back in to Europe - I really fear people who wouldn't usually vote for Labour may just do so to get back into the club.

At least you have now started to realise the impact of the decision , the weak pound is just one of many factors that will make it a lot harder for people not only now but in the future. Working in the Fintech industry nobody sees the pound recovering to any great extent after 2019 and many see it on a parity with the dollar by late 2020.

Of course Brexit numpties will tell you all about armies , how corrupt EU is , laws that they can't name , not proping up EU banks (which in reality we don't) all as reasons why we should leave but the devaluing pound no matter what deal is negotiated is going to be what hits your average working person like a cricket bat simply because we import about 50 % of our food , just about all our oil and a high proportion of our clothes, things that they buy on a day to day basis and with a currency worth less and less and with most of them already struggling to make ends meet, they will be in deep dooh dooh by 2020.

Still if turkeys want to vote for Christmas let them , poverty is also about making the wrong decisions in life as much as it is about where you start from.

[WTFH]

Meh, makes almost zero difference to me tbh - should just be funny what 'facts' come out about the deal before any potential vote, given the level of 'facts' on both sides before the 1st ref

There’ll be £350 million for the NHS.

And the “small blip” and “difficulties” in the economy, particularly for small businesses who don’t have the money to change their systems to work with new cross border regulations, well if they close down, that’s not an important price to pay for the uncertainty of whatever we end up with. It’s exciting times.

[northernladyuk]

"Leaving the EU" means "leaving the EU". All of it. The end.

We know the ballot paper stated leaving the EU. It just didn't define whether the UK would stay or remain in the custom's union, the single market, the ECHR or the free movement of labour area. So the referendum delivers no mandate in these areas. Some other (non-EU) states participate in one or more of these.

[northernladyuk]

Meh, makes almost zero difference to me tbh - should just be funny what 'facts' come out about the deal before any potential vote, given the level of 'facts' on both sides before the 1st ref

There will be a defined deal that can be put on the table for a referendum.

[BrilloPad]

The UK is now full. Except Surrey. All the new arrivals must be housed there.