Contract fallen through

[northernladuk]

But if someone is bad mouthing your reputation and stopping you getting work and the world is small you need to deal with it.

Personally the world is not small but some agencies and companies are just crap at times and use excuses that make things worse rather than better. I reckon this is one of those cases

Indeed but what can you do about it? For a start he hasn't a clue who has said it if at all so will just be firing shots off in the dark. If he get's it wrong it will just damage his rep further. Secondly it is their opinion and no amount of evidence is going to change it. Maybe politely asking for some feedback and hope the agent is in a helpful mood to try find the source but that will be a long shot.

It is highly likely this is a one off and probably a lot more than meets the eye. It could be they are pulling this so they can use the clause in the contract to get rid immediately rather than serve notice etc etc.

[eek]

Indeed but what can you do about it? For a start he hasn't a clue who has said it if at all so will just be firing shots off in the dark. If he get's it wrong it will just damage his rep further. Secondly it is their opinion and no amount of evidence is going to change it. Maybe politely asking for some feedback and hope the agent is in a helpful mood to try find the source but that will be a long shot.

It is highly likely this is a one off and probably a lot more than meets the eye. It could be they are pulling this so they can use the clause in the contract to get rid immediately rather than serve notice etc etc.

As I said at the end of my previous comment. It's just a crap agent using a crap excuse which is causing more trouble than its worth. Probably because the op refused to accept "sorry but they don't want you now" as the real answer to the question

[kevpuk]

As I said at the end of my previous comment. It's just a crap agent using a crap excuse which is causing more trouble than its worth. Probably because the op refused to accept "sorry but they don't want you now" as the real answer to the question

Or probably declined to sign an opt-out.....

[NigelJK]

Well the client did want me (apparently) as they set up the (not opted out) contracts (at the forth attempt). My gut feeling is it's the Agency, and if so there's no harm to my reputation as it's just a crap agency, which I'd rather find out now than later. BUT if it was a deliberate sabotage, by one of my previous colleges, then I want to ensure that
a. they don't do it again to someone else
b. retract the remarks.

I'm not bothered about the contract per se as I do have a very strong skill set. However working in the field in which my skills are most up to date is now off the menu it seems.

And yes my primary effort is in getting some work together. Life is sometimes unfair and as a general rule I roll with the punches, but this was apparently blatant lying to sabotage my contract.

[kevpuk]

Well the client did want me (apparently) as they set up the (not opted out) contracts (at the fourth attempt). My gut feeling is it's the Agency, and if so there's no harm to my reputation as it's just a crap agency, which I'd rather find out now than later. BUT if it was a deliberate sabotage, by one of my previous colleagues, then I want to ensure that
a. they don't do it again to someone else
b. retract the remarks.

I'm not bothered about the contract per se as I do have a very strong skill set. However working in the field in which my skills are most up to date is now off the menu it seems.

And yes my primary effort is in getting some work together. Life is sometimes unfair and as a general rule I roll with the punches, but this was apparently blatant lying to sabotage my contract.

[Dominic Connor]

Revenge and Mitigation

Seems to me you have two plausible goals, doing over the person that bad mouthed you and making sure it does not happen again.

The first step has to be a Subject Access Request under the Data Protection Act, one each to the agency and client.

They may resist this so an escalation to the ICO may be in order, a cynical person would use the wording of your request to set the two parties on to each other and wait for one to dib in the other.

Retribution once you've identified the source has many forms and I have to say that litigation is probably not your best option.

(Disclaimer, I've even less of a solicitor than Roger Sinclair)

In almost all permie contracts, there is a clause, saying
"Don't give references, ever, not under any circumstances, are you stupid or what". Because references open up a tar pit of liability and hassle and as any lawyer will advise you, sue the people with the money, so if in the course of his work someone has libelled you, their employer is the target of choice.

Instances I know of include:
Giving a bad ref because of racism.
Given a wholly accurate ref that included criminality ,but HR screwing up and giving it for the wrong person.
Giving a reference for "a mate" who beat up a secretary at his new firm.

HR may want a reference for employing people, but it is their job to reduce the risk of actually giving one themselves.

That means you can report the referee to his employer, possibly accompanied by a letter from your solicitor, not quite cheap but will get your enemies fighting amongst themselves even more.

If your enemy gets a rocket from his employers, he will be more circumspect in future, you may cause him enough pain to feel satisfaction.

Yes, I'm a recruiter, I never said I was a *nice* one did I ?

[NigelJK]

Another twist

Apparently the Agency are above board. They have spoken to the client and apparently it's one of my former 'colleagues', who has stepped way over the line and given an unasked for reference and backed it up with a code snippet which they have credited to me. I've not seen the code and I'm still not privy to the culprit. I've just called the HR person who was not at their desk.

Does any one actually *know* what the rules regarding bad references actually are?
Currently I'm thinking of starting legal action against my former employers and getting them to find out who's done this. As far as I'm concerned just sending code to your competitors is a dismiss-able offence.

[northernladuk]

Apparently the Agency are above board. They have spoken to the client and apparently it's one of my former 'colleagues', who has stepped way over the line and given an unasked for reference and backed it up with a code snippet which they have credited to me. I've not seen the code and I'm still not privy to the culprit. I've just called the HR person who was not at their desk.

Does any one actually *know* what the rules regarding bad references actually are?
Currently I'm thinking of starting legal action against my former employers and getting them to find out who's done this. As far as I'm concerned just sending code to your competitors is a dismiss-able offence.

It is not a reference as it hasn't been officially requested so you cannot follow it up under those rules. It is just advice your colleague has given your ex client.

What exactly are you going to achieve by doing all this besides letting some steam off. It is 'he says she says' and it would appear you are the one on the backfoot being out on your own and having no business interest with any of the parties. This is going to go nowhere. There is nothing in law that stops your ex colleague pointing out something he believes to be true. You are never going to prove otherwise and any attempt to do so will just be utterly pointless and very expensive.

Follow it up on a personal level with your ex-colleague if you really must and ask him why and what's gone on but there is just no point going legal on this. It will cost a packet of money and time for nothing. If it hits the papers or gets around you will never get a gig anywhere.

Let it drop, get a gig, let your CV and work speak for you and move onwards and upwards.

[NigelJK]

I take the point about not attracting attention. My approach will be to let my ex-employers know that someone is sending code to a competitor, with the sole intention of depriving me of my income.
I'd expect them to take it seriously.

[northernladuk]

I take the point about not attracting attention. My approach will be to let my ex-employers know that someone is sending code to a competitor, with the sole intention of depriving me of my income.
I'd expect them to take it seriously.

Why? You have no evidence. Just hearsay.