No To Retro Tax – Campaign Against Section 58 Finance Act 2008

[DotasScandal]

Translation:

IN addition for all existing disclosures of schemes (i.e. those made before the Royal Assent) HMRC is reviewing these in order to identify which involve the most money. I can assure you that the accelerated payment notice will only be issued to tax avoidance schemes under DOTAS that bring in the most money.

+1000


www.dotas-scandal.org

[DotasScandal]

Check out the below article, guys...
"An extraordinary state of affairs and arguably inconsistent with the rule of law"
A taster of the nonsense to come!
http://www.rpc.co.uk/index.php?optio...147&Itemid=129
And that is all BEFORE this POS legislation has been approved.
Gauke opening one hell of a Pandora's box with this one.
The string on unintended consequences will be something to behold.

www.dotas-scandal.org

[TykeMerc]

And presumably it means that those schemes it chooses not to pursue are now HMRC approved?

Very unlikely, just means those will be pursued later and quietly when the legislation has been tested in court. There's no way they will ever "approve" anything.

[OnYourBikeGB]

Very unlikely, just means those will be pursued later and quietly when the legislation has been tested in court. There's no way they will ever "approve" anything.

It was a bit tongue in cheek, but I wonder how long it will be before some schemes are being marketed as such.

[TykeMerc]

It was a bit tongue in cheek, but I wonder how long it will be before some schemes are being marketed as such.

That will always be a lie, mind you that's always been the case in reality. Approved in salesman language equates to "we've not been caught (yet)"

[BrilloPad]

Translation:

IN addition for all existing disclosures of schemes (i.e. those made before the Royal Assent) HMRC is reviewing these in order to identify which involve the most money. I can assure you that the accelerated payment notice will only be issued to tax avoidance schemes under DOTAS that bring in the most money.

Is ours considered one that will bring in alot of money?

I know its what HMRC will think and nothing to do with reality - in our case if we eventually lose HMRC will get a fraction of what they think.

[SantaClaus]

Check out the below article, guys...
"An extraordinary state of affairs and arguably inconsistent with the rule of law"
A taster of the nonsense to come!
Tribunal's decision not to follow its previous decision highlights the difficulties with the government's 'follower notice' proposals - RPC Tax Take
And that is all BEFORE this POS legislation has been approved.
Gauke opening one hell of a Pandora's box with this one.
The string on unintended consequences will be something to behold.

www.dotas-scandal.org

Did I read that article wrong or are they going to impose a 50% penalty even if you WIN the case at the FTT?

"The Ardmore decision is a timely reminder that decisions of the FTT are not binding and the FTT is free to choose not to follow an earlier decision. Under the follower notice proposals, you could have a scenario where a taxpayer loses his appeal before the FTT, HMRC then decide to rely upon that decision and issue a follower notice to another taxpayer. The recipient of the follower notice refuses to take the necessary corrective action and HMRC decide to impose a penalty of 50% of the disputed tax. The taxpayer then pursues his own appeal to the FTT which decides not to follow its previous decision (relied upon by HMRC to justify the follower notice) and allows the taxpayer's appeal. Although the tax saving will have been confirmed, the taxpayer will have paid 50% of the disputed tax to HMRC in penalties and he will not be able to recover this penalty from HMRC. This is an extraordinary state of affairs and arguably inconsistent with the rule of law."

[DotasScandal]

Did I read that article wrong or are they going to impose a 50% penalty even if you WIN the case at the FTT?

"The Ardmore decision is a timely reminder that decisions of the FTT are not binding and the FTT is free to choose not to follow an earlier decision. Under the follower notice proposals, you could have a scenario where a taxpayer loses his appeal before the FTT, HMRC then decide to rely upon that decision and issue a follower notice to another taxpayer. The recipient of the follower notice refuses to take the necessary corrective action and HMRC decide to impose a penalty of 50% of the disputed tax. The taxpayer then pursues his own appeal to the FTT which decides not to follow its previous decision (relied upon by HMRC to justify the follower notice) and allows the taxpayer's appeal. Although the tax saving will have been confirmed, the taxpayer will have paid 50% of the disputed tax to HMRC in penalties and he will not be able to recover this penalty from HMRC. This is an extraordinary state of affairs and arguably inconsistent with the rule of law."

You read correctly! If you are served a Follower Notice and do not comply, the 50 (FIFTY!) % penalty that hits you is non refundable, even if the tribunal decides in your favor and it turns out that the follower notice had no ground to exist in the first place!!
Of course, at this stage all of this is a mental exercise... but the world of possibilities that Finance Bill 2014 is opening is reminiscent of the Twilight Zone!
I for one am astonished that instead of making a sensical legislation, Gauke & the gang instead deliberately chose to gear up for what will be an endless stream of legal challenges.
It really sounds like war preparations, from an administration that has decided to go to war against its citizens... Sociopathic thinking at its finest!
These people should be put in straitjackets, not having any business writing laws.

www.dotas-scandal.org

[SantaClaus]

You read correctly! If you are served a Follower Notice and do not comply, the 50 (FIFTY!) % penalty that hits you is non refundable, even if the tribunal decides in your favor and it turns out that the follower notice had no ground to exist in the first place!!
Of course, at this stage all of this is a mental exercise... but the world of possibilities that Finance Bill 2014 is opening is reminiscent of the Twilight Zone!
I for one am astonished that instead of making a sensical legislation, Gauke & the gang instead deliberately chose to gear up for what will be an endless stream of legal challenges.
It really sounds like war preparations, from an administration that has decided to go to war against its citizens... Sociopathic thinking at its finest!
These people should be put in straitjackets, not having any business writing laws.

www.dotas-scandal.org

No wonder they want us out of Europe. None of this would stand up to scrutiny under Human Rights legislation.

[Fireship]

I wrote to my MP and have got the following response:

"I understand that many people are worried about the payment of disputed tax due to their use of schemes either disclosed under DOTAS, or that have failed in another party's litigation about the same or a similar scheme and I can assure you the Minister and Finance Bill Committee are aware of these.

However the Govt is clear there is no inherent presumption that tax under dispute should sit with the taxpayer rather than the Exchequer. Indeed under he current law there are number of circumstances where the tax sits with the Exchequer while the liability is finalised. Therefore it is clear these proposals do not introduce a new principle but rather extend the range os circumstances where the tax sits with the Exchequer while the final liability is determined.

The legislations states that in the case of a follower notice, this will only be issued where the same or very similar tax avoidance scheme has been shown to fail in another party's litigation case. As the consultation response document states, "HMRC will carefully consider whether a case is sufficiently similar to the scheme that has failed litigation before issuing a scheme failure notice and decisions will be subject to governance process".

A taxpayer can then accept the judgement also applies to them and settle the amount of tax due. Or, if they believe the case is not relevant in their circumstances, they can tell HMRC why they think it is not relevant, but would then be subject to a penalty if they do not have a reasonable basis for their conclusion. This removes the incentive that currently exists to delay settlement with HMRC after the follower notice has been issued and encourages taxpayers to settle their case and pay the tax they owe much sooner than present.

IN addition for all existing disclosures of schemes (i.e. those made before the Royal Assent) HMRC is reviewing these in order to identify it is satisfied that no additional liability is due. I can assure you that the accelerated payment notice will only be issued to tax avoidance schemes under DOTAS that are disputed by HMRC. It is not the case that all schemes under DOTAS will automatically be disputed by HMRC and so required to pay the disputed tax.

As you note these new powers will first have to be fully scrutinised by Parliament as part of the Finance Bill and amendments can be tabled at this time.

XXX

I had exactly the same response from my MP, yet another standard response being handed down from above!! Makes you wonder what these people are paid for!!