How explicit schedule should be?

[squirrel99]

I did quite a bit of reading, but this is still unclear - hopefully it's ok to ask

How does schedule normally look like? My contract doesn't include any deliverables, only says:

The provision of specialist services as Programme Administrator. The contract provides that the services will be defined within 48 hours of the start of the agreement between the company and the hirer.

Would you accept this?

Qdos says the contract is outside IR35, but suggests to ask for a schedule of actual deliverables before signing the contract.

[northernladuk]

So as soon as you start they will exercise direction and Control over you? That's truly awful.

QDOS are experts in their field. If they say get one why are you asking us?

[squirrel99]

Thanks for reply

I was confused as Qdos said I am outside IR35. Only when I called them to ask about this clause specifically they said 'well it would be better if you get the schedule now'.

So I will try to get the schedule before signing the contract, but I wanted to make sure I am being reasonable before calling my agency (again) tomorrow morning. They know it's my first contract and their answer to my requests is 'believe me - all consultants do it this way.'

I didn't look at it as a control thing considering that it's a part of the contract - to agree the deliverables at the beginning of the contract. Would it be a good idea to remove this clause then?

[northernladuk]

The contract might be out side IR35 but your working practices will trump that ultimately. You go in to a situation where D&C is almost a given the regardless of how tight you contract is you are stuffed.

[squirrel99]

The contract might be out side IR35 but your working practices will trump that ultimately. You go in to a situation where D&C is almost a given the regardless of how tight you contract is you are stuffed.

Thank you Northernladuk, this is really helpful. I'll push the agency for explicit schedule before signing anything. Better be safe.

[expat]

And BTW as I think you have guessed, agents always say "but everybody else is OK with it".

[squirrel99]

And BTW as I think you have guessed, agents always say "but everybody else is OK with it".

Yes, I noticed... I'll get Qdos to liaise with the agent if he doesn't cooperate. Thanks

[FK1]

I did quite a bit of reading, but this is still unclear - hopefully it's ok to ask

How does schedule normally look like? My contract doesn't include any deliverables, only says:

The provision of specialist services as Programme Administrator. The contract provides that the services will be defined within 48 hours of the start of the agreement between the company and the hirer.

Would you accept this?

Qdos says the contract is outside IR35, but suggests to ask for a schedule of actual deliverables before signing the contract.

I wouldn't. I would ask for two agreements. The first for one week to determine a client's needs and then the second as normal one. It would be then reflect B2B much better.

[squirrel99]

I wouldn't. I would ask for two agreements. The first for one week to determine a client's needs and then the second as normal one. It would be then reflect B2B much better.

Thanks

Do you mean to ask for a draft schedule to be included in contract, and then detailed schedule to be signed off within a week from starting the work?

[FK1]

Thanks

Do you mean to ask for a draft schedule to be included in contract, and then detailed schedule to be signed off within a week from starting the work?

The idea is to follow B2B practice and make two independent contracts. It might be in a form of separate schedules if each of them constitute a new contract. One for their needs analysis and another for work itself.

The first contract (a few days) is like a normal stage for requirements gathering, meetings and then actual contract negotiations. In the very real B2B it is normal to do that for free and definitely with no obligation whatsoever to offer/accept.

It might benefit you as you will commit yourself not so blindly. You might be simply not happy with your certain duties or working conditions.

P.S. But you have to balance between "the proper" thing and "realistic" one. It is your first contract and it might be very important for you. Try to argue politely and negotiate gently.
At least an employee does not negotiate a contract's terms Good luck!