4 weeks notice period with Agency/2 week notice period Agency/Client....

[InigoMontoya]

Hi all. I'm a newbie to the forum, but not to contracting. Your experiences/views would be most appreciated as this is a situation I've neither been in before, nor any of my contractor buddies either.
Am on a 3 month contract on-site at the client's premises; my work contract is between my limited company and an agency. The agency have an overarching contract with the client.
When I agreed the contract with the agency, the contract was written in favour of the agency, i.e. they could give me 14 days notice, I could not give them any. Coming up to summer, if the contract ended early (reason for contract being client recruiting a permanent member of staff), I didn't want to be looking for my next role over the summer, so I basically said I'll accept the contract, but only if there is a 4 week two-way notice period. Agency agreed and put in special condition re. the notice period. As soon as I start the contract, the new permie can start sooner than expected and is now on site. Client give me 10 working days notice, as that is the notice period stated in their Ts&Cs in their contract with my agency. Result = I am out of pocket for 10 working days, and looking for a new contract over summer (thankfully market fairly buoyant at the moment so not desparately upset, and England is even having summer weather!). I'm waiting for agency to come back to me, however my view is that the agency shouldn't have agreed/signed up to the 4 week notice period, if their contract with the client didn't align with that; that the error is on their part, therefore they should pay me for the lost income. Having my contract with the agency however, there are other clauses in there that state things like "The contractor must submit an authorised timesheet to be paid; no timesheet=no payment". Clearly I can't get a timesheet authorised as the client won't be stumping up any more cash (they're nice, but they're not that nice...). Has anyone experienced similar/can offer any advice? I have business insurance with legal cover etc, and will be seeking advice that way, just wondered if anyone else has come across this/their outcomes etc. Thanks in advance... Great forum by the way Contractor UK ... Very useful. Many thanks....

[malvolio]

Standard answer - no work = no pay. That's what all those subsidiary clauses are about. No doubt others will be along shortly to say why that's wrong. Don't listen to them.

However, the agency will claim (with some justification) that the notice period can be honoured but since you don't have client approval of work done, they are not obliged to pay you anything. You are also more likley to spend more than you gain pursuing it, even if you do get two weeks pay: depends on how much you value principle over getting the next gig.

And no the agency shouldn't have issued a contract they can't really honour - but given the above, did they actually do that?

[SueEllen]

Forget about it.

The agency should have written the contract to match the client contract but haven't done so. Yes you could sue but with all the effort it takes and money you get back you are better just getting another contract especially as doing a permie's work you are either through an umbrella company or operating under IR35.

In future just be aware why you have been brought in by the client and listen to what they say about the term not the agency.

[northernladuk]

. Having my contract with the agency however, there are other clauses in there that state things like "The contractor must submit an authorised timesheet to be paid; no timesheet=no payment". Clearly I can't get a timesheet authorised as the client won't be stumping up any more cash

That is the answer and will be in any notice period/binned early issues.

[Wanderer]

Having my contract with the agency however, there are other clauses in there that state things like "The contractor must submit an authorised timesheet to be paid; no timesheet=no payment".

Hello.

Did you opt out the the Agency Regulations?

What does the contract say about early termination? Often they have some clause that they can terminate early for no reason which makes a mockery of the notice period, though no one can tell me what the notice period actually means if they don't have to honour it.

For your opening shot, I would suggest that you invoice them for the notice period and see what happens. I can tell you for a fact that if you don't invoice them then you definitely won't get anything.

If they refuse to pay up then get a contract lawyer to review your contract to see where you stand. It may be that your contract has some clause that invalidates the notice period or it may be that you have a strong case and they need to pay up.

Let us know what you do and how you get on.

[malvolio]

Hello.

Did you opt out the the Agency Regulations?

Irrelevant. No work = no timesheet = no monies owed = agency not withholding payment.

What does the contract say about early termination?

As per the OP the agency says 14 days. The client says 10 to the agency

Often they have some clause that they can terminate early for no reason which makes a mockery of the notice period, though no one can tell me what the notice period actually means if they don't have to honour it.

You need to learn the difference between being told to leave the contract at some point and work on the contract no longer existing or needing to be done. In this case the client has given the correct notice.

For your opening shot, I would suggest that you invoice them for the notice period and see what happens. I can tell you for a fact that if you don't invoice them then you definitely won't get anything.

If they refuse to pay up then get a contract lawyer to review your contract to see where you stand. It may be that your contract has some clause that invalidates the notice period or it may be that you have a strong case and they need to pay up.

Well it's one way to waste a few hundreds and a lot of time and effort.

Let us know what you do and how you get on.

Agreed, although I can probably guess already...

[Wanderer]

Irrelevant. No work = no timesheet = no monies owed = agency not withholding payment.

It is very relevant and without seeing the actual contract terms, you can't make a blanket statement like that.

As per the OP the agency says 14 days. The client says 10 to the agency

Uh, the original post says "4 week two-way notice period", however what I was referring to was the provision for early termination without notice which may override the (allegedly meaningless) notice period in the contract.

You need to learn the difference between being told to leave the contract at some point and work on the contract no longer existing or needing to be done. In this case the client has given the correct notice.

Once again, we haven't seen the contract so we can't presume that.

Well it's one way to waste a few hundreds and a lot of time and effort.

Well, it's either that or bend over and get shafted. It's just that I don't automatically choose the getting shafted option....

[TheFaQQer]

there are other clauses in there that state things like "The contractor must submit an authorised timesheet to be paid; no timesheet=no payment"

It is very relevant and without seeing the actual contract terms, you can't make a blanket statement like that.

One assumes that the clause paraphrased by the OP is close enough to the actual contract term.

[Wanderer]

One assumes that the clause paraphrased by the OP is close enough to the actual contract term.

Sure, but the point I'm making is that the opt out status will determine if that clause is valid or not, therefore the opt out status is very important here...

[TheFaQQer]

Sure, but the point I'm making is that the opt out status will determine if that clause is valid or not, therefore the opt out status is very important here...

If you aren't opted out, then you are entitled to be paid for the work that you did.

In this case, there was no work done, so I can't see that agency regulations are relevant to this situation.

How do the agency regulations have any application here?