Tackling Non Compliance in the Umbrella Market Help needed

[lucyclarityumbrella]

Even worse when HMRC pull out the MSC Legislation again looking at PSC's!

[jamesbrown]

Problem is, all of the agenices i have spoken to are only open to offering auto enrolment, so SIPP salary sacrifice could be a no no under agency PAYE.

As you will have noticed in recent press reports, that is a target for elimination or rendering less generous, so the main practical benefit of umbrella employment would then fall away.

Putting aside the way this has arisen and is likely to be implemented, which is unsurprisingly flawed, the market should be better without umbrellas - the fewer intermediaries the better. There are, of course, some excellent umbrellas around, including your own, that have worked hard to provide an excellent service in the context created by gov't, but the context sucks and there is really no good reason for umbrella companies to exist. They always had a shelf life because they are a product of a peculiar set of circumstances that are sensitive to gov't intervention.

[agentzero]

I agree and I am not targeting Clarity or Lucy with my comments. From the worker's perspective the umbrella company does the same thing, with nuances between them purely due to the operating decision of the umbrella company. People just want paid and the option to do all those PAYE things PAYE earners do: pay student loan repayments, contribute to a pension with a few niches in some cases.

I don't see an inside ir35 worker as a contractor: no expenses at all or as good as none, similar day rate to outside ir35 but none of the benefits otherwise. If you're going to be out of work sometimes and have the associated risk, inside ir35 is better forced down a PAYE route.

On another note, I think a lot of these measures will be in tandem with outside ir35 being banned. Some recent HMRC wins and setting precedent suggests there is only one way this is all going unfortunately.

[lucyclarityumbrella]

I agree and I am not targeting Clarity or Lucy with my comments.

It would take more that that to offend me

On another note, I think a lot of these measures will be in tandem with outside ir35 being banned. Some recent HMRC wins and setting precedent suggests there is only one way this is all going unfortunately.

From conversations, I cannot see how they will implement it in practice, aside from anything else there is a legal requirement for them to give software providers adequate time to accommodate the amends, and if they provide actuals by October that will only give 6 months to implement, so I think there may be a case for delay from a technical perspective!

[eek]

Problem is, all of the agenices i have spoken to are only open to offering auto enrolment, so SIPP salary sacrifice could be a no no under agency PAYE.

Yep but the agency would have no choice but to advertise PAYE rates which would make your typical contract rate very unappealing.

However if HMRC was clueful they would be doing the exact opposite of the current approach - creating a market of x00 regulated umbrella firms who are watched closely and insisting that agency workers get paid via one of those organisations.

That would solve a whole heap of problems beyond just our world that unions and MPs know all about but prefer to sweep into the too difficult pile.