Public sector IR35 consultation launched

[Fred Bloggs]

Today it is the public sector contractors. Tomorrow it will be the private sector will it not? Surely it is the private sector contractors who are the real target, are they not?

[bobspud]

For a while the mentality at one of my clients was: "It won't matter if we do this to the contractors, because our friends in Cap G or Fujitsu etc will be able to find us nice sheeple to replace all those grumpy contractors"... Then they started to try and find people that could get the right clearances let alone ones that have them already and the panic started to set in. It's amazing how many people work for those big companies that are going to fail clearances because they have criminal records or anti-social habits that even their own firms hadn't noticed...

[eek]

Today it is the public sector contractors. Tomorrow it will be the private sector will it not? Surely it is the private sector contractors who are the real target, are they not?

Nope. You're average private sector company will play the system to get the person they want, public sector will go for an easy life (i.e. Just list everyone as in ir35).

[SimonMac]

Today it is the public sector contractors. Tomorrow it will be the private sector will it not? Surely it is the private sector contractors who are the real target, are they not?

Possible, but unlikely, seeing as the crux of this "problem" is the likes of the NHS and BBC getting caught with "freelancers" who have been on the books for years and are part and parcel of the organisation and the backlash that came afterwards

[bobspud]

Nope. You're average private sector company will play the system to get the person they want, public sector will go for an easy life (i.e. Just list everyone as in ir35).

I wouldn't bet on that. Yes some departments will do the easy thing or talk that talk BUT when they suddenly see the ramifications that will change. In fact I am betting that after the complete cluster cuss that beaker caused when he tried this the last time, there will be far fewer government departments that will be prepared to watch their budgets explode while the treasury are demanding cuts or the collapse of their delivery plans due to the loss of key staff and no easy way to replace them with cleared staff.

By contrast if a Bank gets told declare their contractors inside IR35, for them it will be no worse than an across the board rate cut followed by mass bob importation.

[eek]

I wouldn't bet on that. Yes some departments will do the easy thing or talk that talk BUT when they suddenly see the ramifications that will change. In fact I am betting that after the complete cluster cuss that beaker caused when he tried this the last time, there will be far fewer government departments that will be prepared to watch their budgets explode while the treasury are demanding cuts or the collapse of their delivery plans due to the loss of key staff and no easy way to replace them with cleared staff.

By contrast if a Bank gets told declare their contractors inside IR35, for them it will be no worse than an across the board rate cut followed by mass bob importation.

The problem there is that if I am any good why would I risk a public sector contract which has been marked as outside scope while there is a risk that HMRC could use me as a Guinea pig. personally I will be walking away regardless of the state of the project if any change occurs in April next year.

Oh and to beat the rush I'm off in September just to really emphasis the issue

[LondonManc]

I wouldn't bet on that. Yes some departments will do the easy thing or talk that talk BUT when they suddenly see the ramifications that will change. In fact I am betting that after the complete cluster cuss that beaker caused when he tried this the last time, there will be far fewer government departments that will be prepared to watch their budgets explode while the treasury are demanding cuts or the collapse of their delivery plans due to the loss of key staff and no easy way to replace them with cleared staff.

By contrast if a Bank gets told declare their contractors inside IR35, for them it will be no worse than an across the board rate cut followed by mass bob importation.

No worse than?

[Fred Bloggs]

Possible, but unlikely, seeing as the crux of this "problem" is the likes of the NHS and BBC getting caught with "freelancers" who have been on the books for years and are part and parcel of the organisation and the backlash that came afterwards

I suppose it will be easier to just gradually hike the dividend tax up to 15 then 20%. Then IR35 wouldn't really matter so much.

[flamel]

I suppose it will be easier to just gradually hike the dividend tax up to 15 then 20%. Then IR35 wouldn't really matter so much.

When this comes to pass (and it surely will), together with new SDC / IR35 rules, then contracting as an option is effectively dead. Let's face it some of us only do the work we're in for the money - I'd never go perm in my field, far too dull.

In the long term, people will leave the contract market and go perm or abroad, giving rise to a skill shortage, thus driving rates up to the point where it becomes worth it again. It could take a few years though.

Will I be able to live in, say, France if Brexit happens?

If the worst happens and we're locked in with nowhere to go, then I've got no plan B.

[bobspud]

The problem there is that if I am any good why would I risk a public sector contract which has been marked as outside scope while there is a risk that HMRC could use me as a Guinea pig. personally I will be walking away regardless of the state of the project if any change occurs in April next year.

Oh and to beat the rush I'm off in September just to really emphasis the issue

I wouldn't recommend being lubed up for test cases either. I'm just saying that there are a few months before the death knell and ironically it won't be the contractors that are fighting hardest against the rule standing.

Im already back in the private sector looking forward to you joining me