Reply to: Umbrella company in public sector

[lucyclarityumbrella]

If the contract is outside IR35 then it might be worth considering operating through a PSC.

Public Sector so the likelihood of outside IR35 is probably slim, or the end client is unlikely to want to take that risk.

[Yonmons]

[QUOTE=moggy;2476352

With regards to your original post, the Umbrella rate only looked more favourable as it included holiday and employers ni. unless you are able to claim expenses the PAYE rate would equate the same figure less perhaps the Umbrella cost[/QUOTE]

^^ Exactly that I have accepted a PAYE role in the NHS (see my thread) Surely you fall into IR35 if they are only offering you Umbrella / PAYE ? (Otherwise LTD option would be offered) Watch out for those expenses you may well get tripped up !

[moggy]

as another poster suggested, if you name the three brollies you were directed towards Lucy may be able to tell us how they scored when going through their compliance checks at AUCAE

I wonder if post weekend the agency you work with are just as keen to direct you towards the same umbrellas

With regards to your original post, the Umbrella rate only looked more favourable as it included holiday and employers ni. unless you are able to claim expenses the PAYE rate would equate the same figure less perhaps the Umbrella cost

[TheFaQQer]

No platting is a word.

Indeed - if NCOTBAC can define "platting" without recourse to a dictionary or similar, I'll retract the post

[SueEllen]

Is posting while banned a bannable offence?

And plaiting

No platting is a word.

[TheFaQQer]

All very nice theory but platting fog would be easier.

Is posting while banned a bannable offence?

And plaiting

[NCOTBAC]

If you are not subject to SDC and are therefore able to claim expenses for travel and subsistence it might be an idea for you to use the ESS tool to assess what would be your status under IR35.

If this comes back as your being outside IR35 then you could ask the end client for information on how they assessed the status of the contract in the first place.

If you are not subject to SDC then that may indicate a lower risk of IR35, or an outside IR35 position.

If the contract is outside IR35 then it might be worth considering operating through a PSC.

All very nice theory but platting fog would be easier.

[Patrick@Intouch]

If you are not subject to SDC and are therefore able to claim expenses for travel and subsistence it might be an idea for you to use the ESS tool to assess what would be your status under IR35.

If this comes back as your being outside IR35 then you could ask the end client for information on how they assessed the status of the contract in the first place.

If you are not subject to SDC then that may indicate a lower risk of IR35, or an outside IR35 position.

If the contract is outside IR35 then it might be worth considering operating through a PSC.

[lucyclarityumbrella]

I keep hearing that i can claim but through self assessment at the end of the tax year rather than weekly pay.

I would honestly say you can probably forget the self-assessment route to reclaim it if you are Public Sector. If you want to be 100% sure, take your job spec, and contractor of employment with the umbrella, and ask HMRC to determine your status. We have had some contractors that have been able to ascertain their status this way... at the end of the day, they are the only people who will be able to give you a concrete answer.

Gut feeling (as per previous message from HMRC) is that if you are inside IR35 for the assignment, then you are being treated as an employee, in which case you would be highly unlikely to be declared not under SDC by HMRC.

[Wullie36]

Hi - thanks so much for the advice but it is a temporary contract? i only have 6 months from the end client through agency to brolly.

I keep hearing that i can claim but through self assessment at the end of the tax year rather than weekly pay.

You mention your client is a public sector body, so just to clarify and this is words from our contact at HMRC (so irrelevant of any so-called SDC Test):

"I think it most likely that someone would be subject to SDC if they are deemed to be within IR35 or the new Chapter 10 for off-payrolling in the public sector. I suppose that it is possible, that this is not the case, but highly unlikely."

Pretty much a conclusion in my eyes!

[lucyclarityumbrella]

You mention your client is a public sector body, so just to clarify and this is words from our contact at HMRC (so irrelevant of any so-called SDC Test):

"I think it most likely that someone would be subject to SDC if they are deemed to be within IR35 or the new Chapter 10 for off-payrolling in the public sector. I suppose that it is possible, that this is not the case, but highly unlikely."

Pretty much a conclusion in my eyes!

[northernladuk]

If you were willing to name one or all of the brollies we could probably be able to tell you more.

[northernladuk]

It does appear to be possible in very rare cases to pass SDC but looking at the guidance it's very difficult to see how. We don't know your circumstances and what test the umbrella carried out but I'd be very surprised if they know enough about the role for it to be worth more than the paper it's written on.

http://www.contractoruk.com/news/001...means_you.html

[northernladuk]

But the second paragraph of that link clearly states.

You can’t claim for travelling to where you work, unless it’s a temporary place of work

This is exactly what you will be doing so pretty black and white.

A good guide on this is on the Contractor Umbrella site here.

http://www.contractorumbrella.com/ne...pril_2016.html

[malvolio]

It's not grey at all. If you are employed by an umbrella, your normal workplace is your permanent place of work so commuting and subsistence costs aren't allowable. Go to another workplace for that client for a short term piece of work and they may be, but not your normal place of work.

If you're designated as inside IR35, SDC doesn't really come into it afaik.