Reply to: Goodbye faithful retainer

[gadgetman]

I bought three Dell laptops just over a year ago and I'm less than impressed.

Laptop #1 was a bottom of the range Inspiron for my son - this is still in one piece but the (upgraded) battery is dead and the unit gets too hot to use on your lap. The fan is also extremely noisy and intrusive.

My daughter got a slightly higher spec Inspiron (1510) which as far as I am aware is still okay but this uses the same basic chassis as my one (see below).

I bought a medium range Inspiron 6400 with all the bells and whistles. On mine (which I treat very carefully) one of the hinges is now broken so attempting to close the lid distorts the case on that side almost to snapping point - so basically I can't close it and it now doesn't leave the house.

I too will be looking for a replacement but it won't be Dell.

[Moscow Mule]

I'd kludgey and awkward!

I actually really like it. If they bought out a touch pad with all of the multi-touch gestures (double click, zoom etc) for a desktop, I'd buy it.

[Peoplesoft bloke]

.........

Getting back to the laptop point. Was going to replace my trusty Thinkpad with a MacBook Pro but my brother has had a complete nightmare with his. It's on it's third return to Apple since November! So far it's had one screen replacement and two keyboard replacements. What a result!!!

.......\.

Interesting - my Ma's (macbook) has had to go back under warranty for a new keyboard in less than a year's use. She does use it a lot but even so....

[b0redom]

Doesn't CTRL+Click do the same as right click? I'm platform agnostic - I do photo stuff in OSX, play games in Windows, and run my server stuff on Linux.

Each one has it's idiosyncracies, none of them is perfect.

[bogeyman]

Info for switchers

http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=75459

And if you can't use two fingers to get a modified click on a macbook you're a complete remtard.

I'd kludgey and awkward!

Just like having to lift your finger off the left button on the Mighty Mouse before you can right click - stupid and awkward.

Classic FORM OVER FUNCTION error.

For a company that boast so much about usability it makes some pretty fundamental errors.

[Moscow Mule]

Info for switchers

http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=75459

And if you can't use two fingers to get a modified click on a macbook you're a complete remtard.

[bogeyman]

Right-click context menus are used almost as much in OS X and it's apps as in Windows.

The first thing you do when you get a desktop Mac is chuck Apple's 'Mighty Mouse' in the bin (it is utter shyte) then get a LaserMouse 8000 from MS or a top-end mouse from Logitec (Extreme?). Both MS and Logitec bluetooth mice work fine with Macs.

Getting back to the laptop point. Was going to replace my trusty Thinkpad with a MacBook Pro but my brother has had a complete nightmare with his. It's on it's third return to Apple since November! So far it's had one screen replacement and two keyboard replacements. What a result!!!

Also, agree that not having an alternate trackpad button is just stupid. Only the adherents to the Cult of Jobs would say outherwise.

Although I use Mac OS X 90% of the time, I find there is a lot more mouse work and clicking required to get things done than with Windows.

On 24" screens, it get's quite tiresome having to throw the mouse pointer up to the menu bar or from left to right. Also the default mouse accelerator curve in OS X is rubbish - especially if you come from the Windows world. You'll find it hard to hit small targets first time.

[Peoplesoft bloke]

Right Clicking in Windows isn't intuative if you've never done it before.

Anyway. nothing stopping you swapping the mac mouse for a standard 3 button ( or more ) wheel mouse. I use a 5 button optical on my iMac becasue I find it more comfortable, especially for using the "squeezy" side buttons.

I'm not using Windows or Mac OS but I still have right click available

HTH

[Spacecadet]

What is the congregation’s current favourite dog’s dangler’s laptop? Technical requirements are that it be pokey enough VS2005/2008, SQL Server, MS Office, Matlab, S+, and the like. It’s going to travel a lot so wireless, good size, weight and battery life. Off duty stuff like watching a DVD, and researching for stuff that should go in “One-A-Day”, but no interest in games.

Back to the point in hand.
What size screen are you happy with?

[NickFitz]

But I was completely gobsmacked about the lack of home and end keys. Do Mac users not do text editing? It's just bizzarre that those are missing.

I can't work out where you're getting that from. You know the cursor keys? The up arrow moves up one line on its own, alt-up is page up, and command-up is top of document. Similarly for the down arrow. The left and right arrows do the same thing for moving a character, a word, or to the beginning and end of a line. You'll find, IIRC, that Windows uses a similar combination of accelerators on small keyboards. This is basically the same combinations as have been used in programs such as WordStar since the early 1980s, so they can't really be considered obscure.

If that's too difficult, plug in a full-size Apple keyboard and you'll find the additional keys are on it, just as on a full-size Windows keyboard. Or if you want, plug in a Windows keyboard - it'll still work.

Personally I'm not bothered by the one-button trackpad, as tapping with one finger to click and two fingers to right-click is so much easier that I never actually use the button at all. I do find Windows laptops frustrating, as the ones I've used don't support tapping, meaning you have to fiddle about with the buttons.

[DaveB]

Right clicking for context menus have been common place since Windows 95, which is 13 years old now. I suppose if you've had your head stuck in the sand for 13 years, or you're only now using your very first computer, then it might confuse you. Plus if there's a button in front of you, you're going to try it.

Doesn't mean it's intuative, just that it has become the de facto standard in Windows.

I know Macs don't have right click, and it's always puzzled me that they'd got this far with such an obvious deficiency, but I assume Mac software is designed with that in mind and Mac aplogists don't feel it needs it.

They do, you click with both fingers on the mouse instead of just the left finger to get the same functionality. The Apple mouse has sensors under the shell that can pick up where you are clicking on it even though it only has "one button". But yes, most Mac software doesnt actually need you to right click to do stuff, unless it's the MS Office apps.

That may be true. But my point was if you're buying a MacBook as an alternative to a PC based laptop primarily to run Windows software believing that it does just as well because it can run XP, you'd struggle without the standard PC user interface.

You do get the standard windows interface, and you can just as easily use a standard 3 button USB mouse on it if you want to, and since it's a macbook the touchpad works identically on windows anyway.

But I was completely gobsmacked about the lack of home and end keys. Do Mac users not do text editing? It's just bizzarre that those are missing.

We do, and they are there, just not implemented in the same way as Windows. If you run XP on it they work exactly the same.

But I may be too dumb to buy an inferior product for twice the price just to get a trendy brand name. I'll stick with my Dell.

Suit yourself. I'm quite happy with superior build quality and style in a package that does everything I need.

I've used PC's for the best part of 20 years, started in DOS and went from there. Switched to a Mac last year and now I wouldnt go back. It's not perfect, no sytem is, but it knocks spots of a bog standard beige Wintel box.

[Moscow Mule]

I know Macs don't have right click, and it's always puzzled me that they'd got this far with such an obvious deficiency, .

Once again, with the FUD. It does have a right click (or contextual menu to be more correct), it's just you didn't bother to find out how to use it.

FWIW, I'm with you on the home/end keys, but unlike you I've made the effort to find out how to make my OS of choice behave how I want it to.

[VectraMan]

Right Clicking in Windows isn't intuative if you've never done it before.

Right clicking for context menus have been common place since Windows 95, which is 13 years old now. I suppose if you've had your head stuck in the sand for 13 years, or you're only now using your very first computer, then it might confuse you. Plus if there's a button in front of you, you're going to try it.

I know Macs don't have right click, and it's always puzzled me that they'd got this far with such an obvious deficiency, but I assume Mac software is designed with that in mind and Mac aplogists don't feel it needs it. That may be true. But my point was if you're buying a MacBook as an alternative to a PC based laptop primarily to run Windows software believing that it does just as well because it can run XP, you'd struggle without the standard PC user interface.

But I was completely gobsmacked about the lack of home and end keys. Do Mac users not do text editing? It's just bizzarre that those are missing.

But I may be too dumb to buy an inferior product for twice the price just to get a trendy brand name. I'll stick with my Dell.

[DaveB]

The evangelical defense of macs and the obliviousness of their users to some simple flaws is hilarious

No evangelical defences from me.

It's a fact that if you havnt had a reason to right click in windows or been show what it does there is no way of intuitivly knowing what it will do, it is just the way that Microsoft chose to implemented that functionality.

I'm actually suggesting that you get rid of the Apple mouse if you don't like it and replace it with something else. I happen to think the mouse is the weakest point on the desktop Macs, mainly because the side buttons that you squeeze are not very well implemented. Hence I use a standard 5 button mouse myself. I do miss the sidescrolling mouse ball on the Mac mouse though, especially on large spreadsheets.

[HairyArsedBloke]

The evangelical defense of macs and the obliviousness of their users to some simple flaws is hilarious

Yeah, but it’s nice to see other gays/bi’s come out though.