Originally posted by MHPPM
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Reply to: When does SDA Matter?
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Previously on "When does SDA Matter?"
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Originally posted by WTFH View PostThe contractor signed the contract. The contract was based on information and laws as they stood at the time. No misleading was involved.
The people who are complicit are those who support and vote for the government that are railroading the changes in. It’s not the agency or the client who are bringing in the new rules.
Yes, there’s a case to answer - why do some contractors vote for the Tory party?
If someone votes for a party who promise to screw you over, then they screw you over, don’t be trying to claim agents and clients are doing something illegal.
I most definitely did not vote Tory, so not sure why I can't claim this.
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Originally posted by sim2kuk View PostSo, is it the Client who has misled the agency, or the agency that has misled the contractor. Either way, someone has been misled to get the contractor to sign the contract...
Originally posted by MHPPM View PostSo either they are complicit or someone else should be on the hook and not just us poor bandits!
Originally posted by sim2kuk View PostWhich is where the legal question is valid - surely someone has been misleading other parties, and there is a case to answer?
If someone votes for a party who promise to screw you over, then they screw you over, don’t be trying to claim agents and clients are doing something illegal.
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Originally posted by jamesbrown View PostI know there's a lot of acronyms to keep track of, but you've been corrected on this several times (unless you are making a point about something different?). It makes it hard to know what you're talking about.
SDS = Status Determination Statement.
MoO = Mutuality of Obligation (I assume this is what you mean by MOE)
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Originally posted by northernladuk View PostI did point this out in the 2nd post. Shows how much notice he's taking of the advice....
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Originally posted by jamesbrown View PostI know there's a lot of acronyms to keep track of, but you've been corrected on this several times (unless you are making a point about something different?). It makes it hard to know what you're talking about.
SDS = Status Determination Statement.
MoO = Mutuality of Obligation (I assume this is what you mean by MOE)
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Originally posted by MHPPM View PostAgreed it is total Bull - asking clients to do SDA - As if they are going to be impartial - No right of appeal, other than to same client. The client MUST have approved the agency contract or at the very least agree the main points. So either they are complicit or someone else should be on the hook and not just us poor bandits!
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Originally posted by MHPPM View Postasking clients to do SDA
SDS = Status Determination Statement.
MoO = Mutuality of Obligation (I assume this is what you mean by MOE)
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Originally posted by sim2kuk View PostWhich is where the legal question is valid - surely someone has been misleading other parties, and there is a case to answer?
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Originally posted by MHPPM View PostAgreed it is total Bull - Same as employee for task purpose - asking clients to do SDA - As if they are going to be impartial - No right of appeal, other than to same client. The client MUST have approved the agency contract or at the very least agree the main points. So either they are complicit or someone else should be on the hook and not just us poor bandits!
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Originally posted by sim2kuk View PostSo, is it the Client who has misled the agency, or the agency that has misled the contractor. Either way, someone has been misled to get the contractor to sign the contract...Last edited by MHPPM; 5 February 2020, 22:32.
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Originally posted by northernladuk View PostBut it doesn't matter now. The client makes the determination. The agency may guide them as they know more than the client on the situation but ultimately it's down to the client.
In the past it was down to the contractor to do the correct diligence on the contract and have the changes made... so no real agent skin in the game.
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Originally posted by northernladuk View PostRed flag as in the CEST tool being flawed. I'd agree.
I don't think it's as simple as you state it there. The client must determine the role is outside, not the contractor. For key roles it's probably worth the time and effort to change the working practices and engagement methods due to the risk to the project. If the only highly skilled resources will engage IR35 then they have to change the engagement method. The other BoS guys are 10 a penny so not worth the cost. Nothing particularly wrong with that.
I think you are wrong to think some contractors will get outside, it's the roles they do, but at the end you get the same outcome they stay outside... If that makes sense.
Yep, CEST tool not fit for purpose, hence red flag comment, which I've told them (and sent them links to analysis on it).
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Originally posted by MHPPM View PostThere must be some skin in the game for agencies.. how can they define contractual terms and then when the client says they are not correct they just shrug their shoulders?
In the past it was down to the contractor to do the correct diligence on the contract and have the changes made... so no real agent skin in the game.
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