Client SDS outside

[NotAllThere]

I wonder what would happen if a client considers a gig outside and then either treats the contractor as inside or the contractor himself acts as inside.

If HMRC found out, and the client didn't push back legally (or worse, did and lost), then the client would be liable for paye, eenic and ernic. The amount paid to the contract would be considered the net amount.

The client would never use an "outside" contractor again, and the contractor would be looking for a new contract.

That's my guess. Based on a vague recollection of a case when someone self-employed was found to be employed - the liability lay firmly with the client.

[ladymuck]

Getting the contract outside is the easy part. If you're working with just one or two people, getting the working practices to match is also easy. Once you start having to work with multiple people, the lines start becoming blurred as not everyone knows/cares about the contract and just know that you're the person who does X.

[gorses]

I wonder what would happen if a client considers a gig outside and then either treats the contractor as inside...

Exactly this.

It's a constant battle reminding clients I'm not staff. Going forward I was hoping clients would start accepting true B2B arrangements.

However this new gig I've been offered makes me worry. SDS says out, contract says in/borderline.

[northernladuk]

Interesting point and slightly off topic but I'd imagine you still have a responsibility to make sure your working practices match your contract. You will still need to understand what IR35 is and how to act and stay outside. You shouldn't be accepting perm perks, be given extra work and all the normal stuff. Just because they determine a contract is outside it doesn't mean you don't have to consider IR35 at all anymore.

I wonder what would happen if a client considers a gig outside and then either treats the contractor as inside or the contractor himself acts as inside. I'd guess if HMRC get wind this is happening we'll be back to square one with random investigations as we are now some point in the near future.

[simes]

Between now and 5th April, No. It is your responsibility to correctly determine.

If after 6th April, then yes. ….Unless you want to pick a fight and provide reason for getting the client to understand your reasons for self determining Outside. But even then, if you get it wrong, then it will still be the client's responsibility to pick up the tab if they get investigated and found at fault.

[gorses]

So if a client gives an SDS outside is that it as far as my IR35 liability goes?

Been offered a new contract which has a few points that would traditionally make me worried. Normally I wouldn't accept and challenge. However they will give an SDS outside.