Reply to: Clarity on IHT position?

[starstruck]

My understanding from when this came up years ago was that IHT could only potentially apply to certain types of trust and only under certain circumstances, but that as a starting point, to know the type of trust you need the deeds which are often not available to anyone and so it was just as hard for a scheme member to know as HMRC. I spoke to someone in one of the big 4 about settling a v. long time ago (it was a free call to see if I wanted to engage them) and they were very much of the opinion that IHT was a non-worry. People who they had settled for, paid some money but it was peanuts compared to the overall settlement. It's all very vague and uncertain and I literaly think we will have to wait for some scheme users to die, to see what HMRC do with their estates, to know more. Either that or pay a fortune to a trust expert but even then most people have no trust documentation to offer them anyway!

[meanttobeworking]

While you are probably right - you have to remember that HMRC is made up of different departments who often compete with each other.

It's perfectly possible that the IHT team could need to look for some money at some point and target some unsuspecting people...

When I was speaking to one of the people in the loan charge team, I said:

"It's almost like nobody in HMRC knows how to explain why IHT might apply, but nobody wants to be the person from HMRC that goes on record as saying it doesn't", and he kind of agreed with me.

It's madness that things like this can be so owner-less, although it's clear that this plays to the benefit of HMRC.

[eek]

I tried to get an answer on this exact question from WTT for months, I sent them the trust deeds, but they refused to look at them or to give me an opinion; they wouldn’t even tell me what type of trust it was based on the wording of the deeds. If I remember correctly, they gave me some excuse about Big Group not being for ‘personal’ advice, but I suspect they didn’t know the answer. Funnily enough Phil Manley did better on this one, he managed to get a letter from HMRC stating that for the scheme in question they didn’t have enough information available to make any decision regarding IHT. Maybe we need to wait for people to start dying before we see some answers!

Out of curiosity, how is big group going? I left many years ago now so have no idea. Have they gone to court?

I don't know because I was never a member - but I suspect both you and me will have reached the same conclusion (that they haven't)..

[starstruck]

+1 - it's the sort of thing only webberg could answer and he's been chased away over the years. So find a specialist and ask them...

I tried to get an answer on this exact question from WTT for months, I sent them the trust deeds, but they refused to look at them or to give me an opinion; they wouldn’t even tell me what type of trust it was based on the wording of the deeds. If I remember correctly, they gave me some excuse about Big Group not being for ‘personal’ advice, but I suspect they didn’t know the answer. Funnily enough Phil Manley did better on this one, he managed to get a letter from HMRC stating that for the scheme in question they didn’t have enough information available to make any decision regarding IHT. Maybe we need to wait for people to start dying before we see some answers!

Out of curiosity, how is big group going? I left many years ago now so have no idea. Have they gone to court?

[DealorNoDeal]

Compound interest over 30-odd years - assuming an average lifespan - will mount up rather quickly. If this is likely to apply too your position, ignoring the potential issue is not a wise move.

HMRC charge simple interest (not compound) but I get your point. The interest rate is currently way below inflation, so in actual fact the debt would be shrinking over time.

Anyway, in the grand scheme of things in life to worry about, this wouldn't be anywhere near the top of my list.

[malvolio]

As I understand it, only certain types of trusts are liable to IHT, and isn't there a threshold below which you don't have to pay anything?

Anyhow, the worst that could happen is you'd have to pay it, and I imagine the amounts involved would be minor compared to the income tax.

I certainly wouldn't be chasing around HMRC trying to pay something that they don't seem to have a clue about.

Compound interest over 30-odd years - assuming an average lifespan - will mount up rather quickly. If this is likely to apply too your position, ignoring the potential issue is not a wise move.

[DealorNoDeal]

It's perfectly possible that the IHT team could need to look for some money at some point and target some unsuspecting people...

As I understand it, only certain types of trusts are liable to IHT, and isn't there a threshold below which you don't have to pay anything?

Anyhow, the worst that could happen is you'd have to pay it, and I imagine the amounts involved would be minor compared to the income tax.

I certainly wouldn't be chasing around HMRC trying to pay something that they don't seem to have a clue about.

[eek]

I suspect HMRC were only ever interested in the income tax. Once you've settled that, I doubt you'd ever hear from them again.

If it was me, I'd forget about it.

While you are probably right - you have to remember that HMRC is made up of different departments who often compete with each other.

It's perfectly possible that the IHT team could need to look for some money at some point and target some unsuspecting people...

[DealorNoDeal]

I suspect HMRC were only ever interested in the income tax. Once you've settled that, I doubt you'd ever hear from them again.

If it was me, I'd forget about it.

[eek]

Yeah, well we have a small coterie who do not like getting bad news or honest opinions if they contradict their own beliefs... Although that is hardly unusual!

Let's be honest to survive on here giving advice you do need a very thick skin...

[malvolio]

Shame - he always seemed pretty decent and transparent

Yeah, well we have a small coterie who do not like getting bad news or honest opinions if they contradict their own beliefs... Although that is hardly unusual!

[meanttobeworking]

+1 - it's the sort of thing only webberg could answer and he's been chased away over the years. So find a specialist and ask them...

Shame - he always seemed pretty decent and transparent

[eek]

Back in the early days of the whole EBT and related schemes discussions, it was one option that if you had an unsatisfied tax position on the back of a loan-based arrangement, HMRC would take their slice out of your estate on your death. I do not recall that option being closed off.

It's really a question for someone with some very specific knowledge I feel

+1 - it's the sort of thing only webberg could answer and he's been chased away over the years. So find a specialist and ask them...

[malvolio]

Back in the early days of the whole EBT and related schemes discussions, it was one option that if you had an unsatisfied tax position on the back of a loan-based arrangement, HMRC would take their slice out of your estate on your death. I do not recall that option being closed off.

It's really a question for someone with some very specific knowledge I feel

[meanttobeworking]

26 hours, 79 views and 0 replies leads me to think the answer is "no"