Reply to: Immigration at record level

[Scoobos]

Cheers bob for the reply.

Despite being crawly and meek about it, I still got neg rep and abuse for being pathetic heh...

I don't think leaving the euro is going to help us much tho.

[TimberWolf]

Very wrong. The generally accepted definition of a 'resident' in most countries is 180+ days of stay in a country. AFAIK, most ICT's stay on for longer than that (and home country treats them as 'non resident'). Even if they don't 'settle' , they are immigrants for all practical purposes until they 'emigrate'

I can't find an original government citation, but the following recent article more or less confirms it:

"...We are also serious in allowing the right kind of skilled immigrants, for example the IT professionals," he said, adding Britain had made exception to their rules to allow inter-company transfer without any limit in the IT sector.
Britain looking to double bilateral trade with India by 2015 - World - DNA

Giving figures, he said last year Britain issued 30,000 visas to the Indian students, with rate of approval being 75%, 60,000 Indian business community people were given visas last year, with 95% cases being approved while 95% of the 2.5 lakh Indian visitors were issued the visas.

[yetanotherbob]

No, ICTs aren't counted any more, Cameron thought it would help.

Very wrong. The generally accepted definition of a 'resident' in most countries is 180+ days of stay in a country. AFAIK, most ICT's stay on for longer than that (and home country treats them as 'non resident'). Even if they don't 'settle' , they are immigrants for all practical purposes until they 'emigrate'

[yetanotherbob]

First of all, to make my own position clear, I too am bothered by uncontrolled, unnecessary immigration that adds no value to the country.
I'm quite upset with how parts of Southall have become slums and hideouts of illegal immigrants.

Originally Posted by Scoobos
lol sorry! Punjabi then.. still not an EU member state and as far as I was aware the national language of this country is English , and it sends a very bad message.

Southall has a large Punjabi population, some there since before the Indian independence.
About Punjab not being an EU member - try to think this way: In WW2, most states of the (present day) EU were at war with each other. Punjabi (Sikh) soldiers fought for Britain in their hundreds of thousands. Punjabi community just happened to grow in Southall over the decades.
(I'm don't intend to sound like Britain in 2012 owes them anything - just giving you a historical context. I don't condone people forming ghettos and not integrating well with the mainstream culture and language)

I really hope that I don't come across as racist or ignorant... I'm
I don't think it's racist to question this stuff.

Not at all. I'm sure a lot of people initially questioned the Cornish signs in Cornwall or even Welsh signs in Wales. Many would argue those are 'indigenous' cultures (and part of EU, so that's ok) so that doesn't apply to Punjabis.

I don't mind th signs at Southall, but I totally agree about the cost of translations - we shouldn't be doing that, but no doubt there is some rule that says we have to.

It's very likely the local residents or some ethnic body paid for it (sense of pride or something). Worth checking. It might also be that it got voted for in the local council?

I don't think it's racist to question this stuff. I don't mind th signs at Southall, but I totally agree about the cost of translations - we shouldn't be doing that, but no doubt there is some rule that says we have to.

Not at all. I might have played devil's advocate with my opinion and let's face it, I have first hand knowledge of the culture even though i keep my distance. But yes, no reason the state should have to pay for these.

[The_Equalizer]

I don't think it's racist to question this stuff. I don't mind th signs at Southall, but I totally agree about the cost of translations - we shouldn't be doing that, but no doubt there is some rule that says we have to.

Another one that isn't mentioned too much is health tourism.

[BrilloPad]

UKIP keep bring this one up. There's not a great deal Cameron can do about immigration because of EU membership. Something like 90% is EU related.

So lets leave the EU and join the commmon market.

[The_Equalizer]

About a third is due to the EU. Most immigration from Asia. See the table in the article.

Immigration to the UK: the key facts visualised | UK news | guardian.co.uk

Most of the EU immigration comes from Eastern European countries after UK took a voluntary decision to allow them in. Other countries in the EU have or have had restrictions.

Most interesting. The basic problem is there are too many people in the UK and the South-East in particular.

[Sysman]

Put it this way the majority of my money will be staying here and that's not that I want it to be that way trust me, say for instance I want to move from one area of the city to another. I then have register with the Kreis Bureau in that district, just another way to fleece me out of my money. They're very astute here shame the UK government doesn't introduce the same sort of measures it may put off a few people coming into the UK.

I had that one just to move next door!

Having said that it appears that they have some discretion about the charge. When I swapped cantons I missed the deadline for informing the lot at my new place, took a wad of money expecting to get fined for that, but they found a discount price for me because I had voluntarily come to their canton. They positively encourage you to come and live in their area because you'll be paying tax there.

But yes, there's a reason the Swiss flag has a plus sign on it

[Peoplesoft bloke]

lol sorry! Punjabi then.. still not an EU member state and as far as I was aware the national language of this country is English , and it sends a very bad message.

I really hope that I don't come across as racist or ignorant... I'm

I don't think it's racist to question this stuff. I don't mind th signs at Southall, but I totally agree about the cost of translations - we shouldn't be doing that, but no doubt there is some rule that says we have to.

[BlasterBates]

UKIP keep bring this one up. There's not a great deal Cameron can do about immigration because of EU membership. Something like 90% is EU related.

About a third is due to the EU. Most immigration from Asia. See the table in the article.

Immigration to the UK: the key facts visualised | UK news | guardian.co.uk

Most of the EU immigration comes from Eastern European countries after UK took a voluntary decision to allow them in. Other countries in the EU have or have had restrictions.

[d000hg]

UKIP keep bring this one up. There's not a great deal Cameron can do about immigration because of EU membership. Something like 90% is EU related.

But then UKIP rely on tabloid-inspired xenophobia to get votes.

[Scoobos]

The signs at Southall were in Punjabi last time I went. Not sure why they are apparently arabic now.

lol sorry! Punjabi then.. still not an EU member state and as far as I was aware the national language of this country is English , and it sends a very bad message.

I really hope that I don't come across as racist or ignorant... I'm guessing it does.. My reason to single out Southall is that even within the Asian population its seen as a problem area, the suicide rate is sky high with people decieved into better lives for some dodgy council house "Landlord's" benefit, for example.

I no longer believe its 90% EU immigrants, and to be honest before the bust I didn't care either - I think the freedom of trade and movement is worthwhile, given we are an island . Once we hit hard times though, our government needs to put the wellbeing of its national citizens over global economics and be a bit more protectionist.

From what I'm seeing in the SE its mainly refugees (no problem with genuine refugees) and economic migrants from outside the EU , Africa, Asia, South America ... Rashid and Rashid for example, in london, specialise in getting people same day visas who have been DENIED entry.. They just call from the ruddy airport and the immigration officers give them the phones.
(edit, they are even on YouTube! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KaLOr5Eg1IA) There's hundreds like this.

Oh dear I'm sounding bad..... I really do like multiculturalism and value hard working immigrants wanting to come to the UK; but we need to be sensible and realise that people are people , irrespective of race - and as a Tory will tell you, there are too many people on the take , just looking to exploit systems.

[The_Equalizer]

UKIP keep bring this one up. There's not a great deal Cameron can do about immigration because of EU membership. Something like 90% is EU related.

[TimberWolf]

I'm sure we were counted in the immigration figures.
Not sure about the ICT's now though.. would be very dodgy if they weren't

No, ICTs aren't counted any more, Cameron thought it would help.

[Peoplesoft bloke]

(Cremated Immigrants don't count as it is considered that ~90% of the immigrant has left)