Reply to: Student revolts; why not work AND study?

[Gibbon]

I understand that some of the summer skools used to be quite interesting.

In a bed hopping sort of way.

Only in the humanities of course.

[SupremeSpod]

There's a handy series for quickly extracting individual binary or hex digits of PI at any position, the Bailey-Borwein-Plouffe formula, only discovered a few years ago.

(No similar ones have been found that work in decimal though, AFAIK)

Very impressive. Easy when you know how, eh?

[OwlHoot]

There's a handy series for quickly extracting individual binary or hex digits of PI at any position, the Bailey-Borwein-Plouffe formula, only discovered a few years ago.

(No similar ones have been found that work in decimal though, AFAIK)

[thunderlizard]

That's the Digits of Pi man!
YouTube - Open University - Pi Digits

[Mich the Tester]

Heh, yeah tbf it didn't take me ages to learn it but I definitely had to concentrate hard to get my head round it! And yes, I have to admit, it took me a bit longer with Hex. I don't think I have a natural aptitude for numbers, but certainly by concentrating hard and working at it I got to grips with it - as you say, it's not that difficult (it just took me a bit of extra work).

Ask this fellow for some help;

[GillsMan]

Exactly who much thinking and concentration did it take to learn binary?

Heh, yeah tbf it didn't take me ages to learn it but I definitely had to concentrate hard to get my head round it! And yes, I have to admit, it took me a bit longer with Hex. I don't think I have a natural aptitude for numbers, but certainly by concentrating hard and working at it I got to grips with it - as you say, it's not that difficult (it just took me a bit of extra work).

[Ignis Fatuus]

Is the proof that 2 is more than 1 any easier? Surely though 1 is greater than 0 by definition?

Depends on the system. The definition of partial or total order is quite distinct from the definition of binary operations that make the system a group or lattice or ring or whatever.

For example, Boolean algebra has 0 and 1 but no defined order, so nothing is "greater" than anything else.

[d000hg]

There are some flies in the ointment. University isn't simply about learning a bunch of stuff, but about exposure to the world and other people. On the frivolous level that includes drinking and partying and sports, university lifestyle really is very different to real life. On a serious level it involves interacting with a bunch of total strangers, and so on.

I don't think there's much wrong with distance learning on the pure learning front, although not being able to chat with your lecture-buddy on the way home abut the lecture, and other such 'casual learning opportunities', may be missed. But Just learning stuff is what you do at school; higher education should be a life-changing thing.

[OwlHoot]

Having just completed a BSc part time while holding down a full time job (day release for Uni from company) I feel I can comment – the biggest issue is time, all spare time is spent studying not a lot of room left for fun. You need a fair whack of dedication to complete the course.

The whole full time uni thing seems to be more about lifestyle than common sense.

As for age it is the norm to get the degree after A levels when it is perceived that you can have more fun & avoid the whole job / responsibility thing for a while.

I started my degree at 30 it was daunting but I was more motivated as I knew the reasons why I was doing it.

So yes you can work & study but only as long as you are motivated & have a good reason to

Congrats on completing the BsC - I doubt many would have the dedication to achieve that working part time, me included.

I guess another advantage of starting a degree not long after A Levels is that students don't regress too far and need to relearn a load of stuff they have forgotten (even if it may be quicker and easier the second time).

Also, the older people get, even by their 30s and 40s, the harder they tend to find learning completely new concepts. I can't speak for anyone else, but most of what I can readily grasp and remember is variations on concepts I already know.

[Moscow Mule]

Surely though 1 is greater than 0 by definition?

Nope, there's a proof. I'm sure it's on the internet one more than one place.

[TimberWolf]

Before you can do that lot, you have to prove 1 is more than 0. Which is a surprisingly long proof IIRC.

Is the proof that 2 is more than 1 any easier? Surely though 1 is greater than 0 by definition?

[Moscow Mule]

Exactly who much thinking and concentration did it take to learn binary?

Before you can do that lot, you have to prove 1 is more than 0. Which is a surprisingly long proof IIRC.

[thunderlizard]

Oh no, I meant something a bit more elitist than that. If you pick the right subject you'll pass a PhD by sheer attrition. I just think it more likely that academic brilliance, at undergraduate or graduate level, will be more common on balance in a dedicated full-time environment.

[BlasterBates]

I don't think you can study to as high a level part-time.

The OU offers part-time PhD's, as do one or two other Uni's.

[Incognito]

Assuming you study for 4 years it'll end up costing about 4 grand; you can get financial assistance and many big employers view OU degrees very favourably. Maybe there's no stigma outside the UK; the OU is known overseas as a very good university; it's also rated highly by all the quality inspection surveys.

The concept of open access is not strange to Europeans; I believe that in Bologna, it's easy to get in to the university, but the exams at the end of the first year are so tough that only about a third can cut the mustard. Selection at the start is not the only way to ensure a high standard of qualifications.

An atypical OU degree is achieved through passing modules which add up to 360 credits. Courses will specify modules which must make up part of that award and other modules which may be optional. Modules are classed as Level 1, 2 or 3 and they correspond to the expected ability of the student were they to be at a traditional University. So a Level 1 module corresponds to first year, level 2 to second year, etc.

Using mine as an example, my current module is a Level 2 module worth 30 credits and it cost me just over £1000. The last 60 credit module I did was a level three module and it cost me just over £2000.

Breaking down the LL.B, I have four compulsory modules (at £2050 each) which make up 240 credits. The four optional modules I have chosen are all 30 credits (4 x £1025) which equates to over £12000. Not quite 4 grand.

Law's a bit special though, I'm sure it's unfunded by the state, so if I was to compare a 60 credit level two module from a Maths degree, it only costs £650.

I went to a tutorial a couple of months back and there were a couple of 'sink estate' single mothers getting their law degree paid for as well as their benefits. They weren't exactly up to the average level of the course, but because they weren't paying for it they weren't really bothered.