Reply to: The Pope - I don't believe this guy!

[xoggoth]

More sense from The Guardian:

Is God scraping the barrel for miracles? | Martin Robbins | Science | guardian.co.uk

And so the story becomes thus: Deacon Jack Sullivan had a pain in his back. After a year it got bad enough that he consented to a fairly routine surgery from which most patients are able to return home in a couple of days. He had the surgery, he got better, and 10 years later he can still walk. Miraculous? Not really

Even if this were a miracle, it would only reinforce a disturbing long-term trend. God used to be able to part seas and flood planets. By the end of the Old Testament he was turning people into pillars of salt and Aaron's rod into a snake. At the time of Jesus, God our omnipotent deity was basically down to party tricks, and now, what, easing an old man's backache for a few months? It's hardly the swaggering, all-conquering God of the glory days.

So what's happened? Are we not devout enough? Is God getting old? Has he lost interest? Are his powers subject to some form of spiritual entropy, leaving him hot and spent in heaven? Perhaps this worrying decline in God's powers is what the Vatican's crack team of miracle investigators should really be researching.

[Platypus]

Very good, you got me their.

Tell me you were being ironic !

[NotAllThere]

If Toynbee is against it, it must have something going for it.

[Pondlife]

I shall deny it.

Nooo! I've just ordered the T-Shirts and mousemats.

[xoggoth]

I shall deny it.

[Pondlife]

It doesn't happen that often but I find myself in total agreement with The Guardian's Polly Toynbee:

Sorry Xog, but that line in itself is worth quoting for posterity.

[xoggoth]

It doesn't happen that often but I find myself in total agreement with The Guardian's Polly Toynbee:

Pope's visit: The wrong prescription for Britain's moral ills | World news | The Guardian

We may disagree on the solutions but at least left and right should be able to agree on what the real issues are in our society, like unemployment, relative poverty, crime, education and a directionless youth. All the Catholic Church and the Christian and Muslim religions offer us is an obsession with trivia, especially about peoples' personal sex lives, all of it based on meaningless unfounded dogma.

The pope's assertion that Christianity gave us our freedoms is hilarious. It did nothing for society in general for 1650 years. The Medicis or the Tudors were more enlightened on rights for the common people than the pagan Caesars? Seriously? Ludicrous. We only started to evolve into something resembling a more just and equal society in the UK when science and commerce started to deliver prosperity via an expansion of a technology based economy. Don't thank the Church, thank the randy libertine Charles 2nd, the Royal society, Newton and all the other rational men who kicked it off.

[TimberWolf]

Russian official sacked for making boys kiss his feet | World news | guardian.co.uk

Who does he think he is...

[minestrone]

Did anyone manage to get through to Ignis Fatuus that it was linguistically incorrect to infer from Pope Bernadette's statement: that he was blaming the British for the Holocaust?

He was nearly correct...

[minestrone]

It really is amazing how entrenched you are.

Scottish Government: Web page currently unavailable.



The CofS handed its parish schools to the state in 1872. Roman Catholic schools were brought into the state system by the Education (Scotland) Act 1918. The state funds Catholic schools which are allowed to keep their distinct religious education, provide access to schools by Catholic clergy and ensure that school staff be acceptable to the Church. The Catholic schools are defined as "faith schools." The others are effectively secular otherwise known as "non-denominational" schools. Religious education continues to be taught in non-denominational schools, as is required by Scots Law. However, what you have encountered is a CofS minister at a supposed non-denominational school and automatically see a conspiracy.

http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Resource/...28/0023554.pdf



Again, there are no CofS state schools in Scotland.

And if you want to be pedantic, the word Protestant does not infer a protestation against the Catholic faith, it was bestowed on those at the time who protested at the ban imposed on Luther and his teachings. Try googling for '95 Theses on the Power and Efficacy of Indulgences.' Quite how you think a Protestant minister is protesting about your faith shows your entrenchment, you forget that both churches are Christian.

And I'm getting off my main piont which is that I think ALL religion should be taken out of schools.

Honestly, for a non catholic you seemed obsessed with our religion, it seems to be the case with a great many non Catholics from this area.

Again I make the claim that non denom schools are Church of Scotland by default as minister is head of worship. Services will be CoS.

The term is Protestant, it is what Ian Paisley meant when he said the other day "What we're doing, we're making a legitimate protest about something that is entirely wrong". Just a shame pastor Jack Glass could not be there with him this time, hurling bottles and abuse at the Pope.

And one would like to remind you of the comment you made last year which was hastily removed the next morning, the lyrics to a well known anti Catholic song, so remind us, how does that go again?

[Incognito]

Incorrect, schools in Scotland outwith the Catholic system all have a protestant minister at the helm, every one. It is incorrect that a Catholic should be given religious instruction from a man that has a religion that by its name protests against the Catholic faith.

I, myself, was a guest at Glasgow Academy this evening, a non dom school where the minister was present.

Please arm yourself with some knowledge before trying to tackle me on this subject.

It really is amazing how entrenched you are.

Scottish Government: Web page currently unavailable.

How many denominational schools are there?

Scotland has 389 state-funded faith schools - 385 Catholic, one Jewish and three Episcopalian. These schools play an important part in education in Scotland. We believe it's important for parents and pupils to have the choice to attend a faith school, if they want to.

The CofS handed its parish schools to the state in 1872. Roman Catholic schools were brought into the state system by the Education (Scotland) Act 1918. The state funds Catholic schools which are allowed to keep their distinct religious education, provide access to schools by Catholic clergy and ensure that school staff be acceptable to the Church. The Catholic schools are defined as "faith schools." The others are effectively secular otherwise known as "non-denominational" schools. Religious education continues to be taught in non-denominational schools, as is required by Scots Law. However, what you have encountered is a CofS minister at a supposed non-denominational school and automatically see a conspiracy.

http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Resource/...28/0023554.pdf

Where the school, whether denominational or non-denominational, is continuous with a faith community, that community’s faith in the “focus of worship”, may be assumed and worship may be considered to be appropriate as part of the formal activity of the school. Where, as in most non-denominational schools, there is a diversity of beliefs and practices, the review group believes that the appropriate context for an organised act of worship is within the informal curriculum as part of the range of activities offered for example by religions, groups, chaplains and other religious leaders

Again, there are no CofS state schools in Scotland.

And if you want to be pedantic, the word Protestant does not infer a protestation against the Catholic faith, it was bestowed on those at the time who protested at the ban imposed on Luther and his teachings. Try googling for '95 Theses on the Power and Efficacy of Indulgences.' Quite how you think a Protestant minister is protesting about your faith shows your entrenchment, you forget that both churches are Christian.

And I'm getting off my main piont which is that I think ALL religion should be taken out of schools.

[NotAllThere]

Did anyone manage to get through to Ignis Fatuus that it was linguistically incorrect to infer from Pope Bernadette's statement:

...that the Nazi desire to eradicate God had led to the Holocaust...

that he was blaming the British for the Holocaust?

...
I, myself, was a guest at Glasgow Academy this evening, a non dom school where the minister was present...

Is that a school that avoids paying taxes by virtue of having established it's main residence in another country?

IGMC

[minestrone]

Actually, I've only really been bleating on about it for the last four or five years. I really do think religion should be taken out of the school. All religions. It's got nothing to do with some disguised sectarian bile. As I have said before, my mother’s half of the family are all Catholic, that makes me 'half Catholic' (well it doesn't really as I was christened CofS, but you see my point) so I feel I am entirely justified to put my point across.

I am an atheist and that is why I wish religion was taken out of the education system. At the end of the day when you teach a child of five years old he'll go to hell if he's bad, you're doing some serious imprinting to that child. Whenever I talk about religion in schools I do always refer back to Scotland as that is the education system I know and in my opinion the most divisive church in Scotland is the Catholic Church. There are no CofS state schools in Scotland, the general assembly believe in non-denominational schooling. There are 2,722 state schools in Scotland, made up of 385 Catholic, one Jewish and three Episcopalian. Do you see what those figures are pointing out, who is creating the divide? I can't seem to find the figures, but I would bet my last dollar on the fact that the majority of those schools are in the West of Scotland. There is a reason why Glasgow has more Orange and Nationalist marches than N.Irelands largest two cities combined.

What you see is some bowler hat wearing, drum beating bigot and to be honest I couldn't be farther from that. I only do it because it noises you up. I have been in a Lodge on three occasions in my life. Each time prior to football games and because it served cheap beer.

However, what I see in you is someone who thinks the right to attend a Catholic school is more important than attending Mass and the Sacraments. That is not faith - that is tribalism.

Incorrect, schools in Scotland outwith the Catholic system all have a protestant minister at the helm, every one. It is incorrect that a Catholic should be given religious instruction from a man that has a religion that by its name protests against the Catholic faith.

I, myself, was a guest at Glasgow Academy this evening, a non dom school where the minister was present.

Please arm yourself with some knowledge before trying to tackle me on this subject.

[Incognito]

On the bus I go to the football on there's quite a few guys who seem to be heavily involved in both. They were trying to get me indoctrinated to the Orange Lodge, they gave up when I asked them did they really believe the world was only 3000 years old.

I think they were offended by my laughter.

[Cliphead]

Ah, now Masonic lodges are meant to be non-sectarian. However, you try applying for membership in the West of Scotland with the name Patrick O'Donnelly and I think that myth would be swept away quite quick.

I've never been in a Masonic lodge yet, but my module exams are getting held in my local one here in October (South of England).

I was actually invited to join although I politely declined. I have to say the majority of members in that particular lodge were professional guys, not sure what demographic makes up others.