Reply to: Why was this not murder?

[KathyWoolfe]

How much does having a common criminal roaming around robbing and generally being a coont cost the government? Not a lot.

How much does putting crims behind bars cost? About £50k pa. for each scrote they lock up.

It isn't the government who has to pay to keep criminals behind bars - it's us, the taxpayer who ultimately foots the bill.

[tim123]

Much like pointing a gun at somebody, pulling the trigger and claiming to be suprised by the outcome.

Actually, it's exactly like that. The issue then at stake is whether the claim is believable, and obviously it was (and in a few cases the gun analogy will be as well)

tim

[Clippy]

I think he was:

"Lloyd Edwards, 19, was convicted of murdering Laila Rezk, 51...
Edwards will be sentenced on Thursday."

[BoredBloke]

Again, why was that not murder.

[Clippy]

And another charming little scrote who should be sent to the front lines:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/7117089.stm

[DimPrawn]

National Service.

Training, discpline, some focus, pick up skills, travel, etc.


It works for a lot of other countries.

[Clippy]

Conscription - straight to Iraq.

They'll learn some discipline and maybe even get shot.

[BoredBloke]

"At the risk of sounding like a Daily Mail reader, how does somebody have 24 previous convictions for anything and still be walking around? Even if it's 24 convictions for dropping litter there needs to be an escalating scale of penalties otherwise what's the point having the law?"

That is a big failing of our legal system. We have this thing with kids where they are allowed to get pi55ed and cause trouble. They get a slap on the wrists and this gives them the impression that there are no consequences for their actions and they continue causing trouble. As their previous grows, so the severity from the courts gets greater - slowly. By the time they eventually get sent down they tend to have an extensive track record.

I'm all up for shaving their heads and painting the word wnaker on them in ink which takes about 6 months to wash off

[scooterscot]

After reading the story in full...

IMO they are evil and have no commitment or respect for others, there age is no excuse. Only a punishment the fits the crime is justified, this was not delivered. If an example is not to be made for such evilness why not set them free and let nature take it's course.

If this happened in Glasgae I could tell you what tomorrow's headlines would be... should that pair be seen wondering the streets.

It's a good kick up the @$£^ they need, hanging is too good for them.

[threaded]

Very few manslaughters are murders. In fact, in the past, a manslaughter would generally be charged as GBH.

Saying all that, actus reus: pushing an unconcious person into a canal, would mean death is fairly certain, and therefore IMHO is murder. Yet, mens rea, requires intention, and I guess the prosecution couldn't prove they intended death, although what they did intend, as if it could possibly be anything else, is one of those things that makes the law appear silly to lay people.

[NotAllThere]

Probably easier to secure a conviction of manslaughter, than of murder.

iirc, the american equivalent of manslaughter is 3rd degree murder.

[xoggoth]

Agree with Vectraman. Whatever the intentions, if death is a result of a deliberate and premeditated action that is likely to cause death, it should be murder.

[DimPrawn]

Here's something to think about.

Look at crime from the governments perspective.

How much does having a common criminal roaming around robbing and generally being a coont cost the government? Not a lot.

How much does putting crims behind bars cost? About £50k pa. for each scrote they lock up.


It ain't rocket science to see why the streets are full of murderers, rapists, muggers and the like.

HTH

[VectraMan]

I guess its not murder because the prosecution couldnt prove it was these guys intention to kill the fulla...merely that their actions lead to his death.

Much like pointing a gun at somebody, pulling the trigger and claiming to be suprised by the outcome.

At the risk of sounding like a Daily Mail reader, how does somebody have 24 previous convictions for anything and still be walking around? Even if it's 24 convictions for dropping litter there needs to be an escalating scale of penalties otherwise what's the point having the law?

[Mailman]

I guess its not murder because the prosecution couldnt prove it was these guys intention to kill the fulla...merely that their actions lead to his death.

Mailman