Reply to: Internal Code of Compliance courses

[ladymuck]

Any FS client will want you do anti-bribery, anti-money laundering, digital security, type "courses". It's pretty much a tick box exercise for them to prove compliance so if you did conduct yourself in a non-legal manner, they can hold their hands up to the regulators and say "well, he did the training, we told him not do it your honour".

There is no IR35 issue when it has a legal/regulatory/compliance requirement behind it.

If they said, we're putting everyone on an Excel for dummies course to use up training budget, then you politely decline the opportunity.

[WTFH]

I did attend a Health & Safety Induction when I started at my last place. How the hell will they know anyway?

I didn't sign anything to say I attended it... was easier to just do it and not make a fuss.

Is that bad practice? But more importantly, how will anyone know?

Many clients have online courses which you sign electronically (or produce an electronic certificate at the end)

The ones that do that tend to be a bit more clued in and ensure that the invitation/requirement is for anyone who has access to their sites or their systems, then specifying a list of: employees, temporary staff, contractors, suppliers, ...

[Lance]

Poxi, you are on the right track with your thoughts. Absolutely stick to it. Ask yourself this question, when a plumber comes to install a new tap for you, does he care what compliance measures you have set up at your house? He will stick to his plumbing industry guidelines. Same applies here.

Say no, tell them you are not an employee and a service provider and engage your lawyer to take this further.

This ^^^^^ is just wrong.

If a plumber were to turn up to a professional building site he will have to abide by their H&S guidelines and other compliance requirements. And that may well involve 'training', even if that's just a 20 minute video on how not to be stupid on site. If he 'politely declines' he's not allowed on site. End of.

[JIDEARE]

How the hell will anyone know?

I did attend a Health & Safety Induction when I started at my last place. How the hell will they know anyway?

I didn't sign anything to say I attended it... was easier to just do it and not make a fuss.

Is that bad practice? But more importantly, how will anyone know?

[DimPrawn]

My current employer wants me to take the company's internal Ethics and Compliance courses stating they are a requirement for contractors as well as employees.

My feeling is that this would adversely affect my working outside IR35 status so I'm refusing.

Does anyone have any thoughts on whether I should capitulate and take it or stick to my guns.

Thanks

If you say no, will it affect your chances of being Employee of the Month again?

[unixman]

My current employer wants me to take the company's internal Ethics and Compliance courses stating they are a requirement for contractors as well as employees.

My feeling is that this would adversely affect my working outside IR35 status so I'm refusing.

Does anyone have any thoughts on whether I should capitulate and take it or stick to my guns.

Thanks

Hi OP. I would say it is ok to attend courses where it is *well* understood that you are a contractor and not an employee. Your client has stated that they want contractors to take the course, so it seems the understanding is there. If you do attend, don't let anyone, or any piece of paperwork, mistake you for an employee. Personally I always try to avoid rubbishy courses, just don't like them.

Incidentally you would be "declining" the invitation, not "refusing".

Ignore northernladuk, He is a waste of space the way he talks to people, and has been for years.

[sludgesurfer]

Double repeat condescension....all we need now is for someone to tell you to "speak to your accountant" or "use google to find your answer" or tell you "you're really not cut out for this contracting gig" and we'd have a full house at CUK bingo

[OwlHoot]

My current employer ...

For a contractor, the words "employer" and "my" in the same sentence are about as appropriate as "kiddy fiddler" and "I'm a".

The word you're looking for is CLIENT!

HTH

[BackupBoy]

Take it or leave the gig. Those are your choices. There are no IR35 implications here.

[Eirikur]

Health and safety briefings are often mandatory for every contractor including builders, cleaners and just day visitors entering a industrial site, so if it's mandatory for everybody don't worry.
Banks and other regulated industries won't let you start until you have done their compliance crap wouldn't worry about that either

[fullyautomatix]

Poxi, you are on the right track with your thoughts. Absolutely stick to it. Ask yourself this question, when a plumber comes to install a new tap for you, does he care what compliance measures you have set up at your house? He will stick to his plumbing industry guidelines. Same applies here.

Say no, tell them you are not an employee and a service provider and engage your lawyer to take this further.

[PoxiLoxi]

Thank you for all your help, this now makes complete sense to me Have a lovely weekend.

[tarbera]

My current employer wants me to take the company's internal Ethics and Compliance courses stating they are a requirement for contractors as well as employees.

My feeling is that this would adversely affect my working outside IR35 status so I'm refusing.

Does anyone have any thoughts on whether I should capitulate and take it or stick to my guns.

Thanks

Stick to your guns - you will be terminated, but will have a warm glow knowing you were right

[northernladuk]

P.S. Might be worth spending two seconds checking whether General is the right place to post your question in future. We have to be nice to you in the Professional fora.... General on the other hand....

[northernladuk]

News just in. New contractor doesn't know everything and doesn't want to assume, so asks question!

I imagine you were born knowing how to do everything.

Your condescending comments have been so helpful. Thanks.

In a twisted way they are. It makes you think about your relationship with your client and what type of training you should/shouldn't do.

Just to tick the box so you can go back to your employer, there is absolutely no problems doing internal code of conduct courses supplied by clients. They have legal responsibilities to make sure all the work done meets various regulations and this is there way of attempting to meet those responsibilities. Trying to stay on the right side of the law and then letting a load of guys come in and work unethically opening the company to risk isn't really much use.

Refusing is just going to make you a problem and also a risk so they'll more like bin you than say OK.