Reply to: The ageing population myth (Very boring thread)

[tiggat]

so a reduction in the rise of spending is a vicious cut. As pointed out above we spent close to the EU average and still have worse outcomes.

Thing about budgets is that they get cut every year in private enterprise. People make do with less and do more.

The NHS needs reform not feeding more money. This panic happens every year we have had a tory government and the NHS tries to use it to hit the government over the head.

If we have bed blockers then do something about them, maybe drop them off at the council office with a few off duty nurses during a quiet period? Make sure the press are invited.

Yes the government acts in a way that increases the demand on the NHS whilst keeping the budget the same, that constitutes a cut, can you really not put two and two together?
I would call anything that constitutes taking away healthcare as vicious, I wouldn't expect a Tory to understand that however.#

"bed blockers" are a direct consequence of cutting the social care budget

printing money is effective devaluing the currency and borrowing off the savers. Yes your pension will be worth less. Sorry if that is hard to understand.

I can't be bothered to educate you more than your Daily Mail informed opinion, here's a good textbook: http://irfanlal.yolasite.com/resourc...%20%202009.pdf

[vetran]

How dense are you exactly? Do you really need it to be spelt out to you that other factors (such as reduced social care spending and general public health spending) have increased demand for NHS services more than 1.5%?






wrong






Typical Tory misunderstanding and simplism of economics.




You understand that governments can literally print money don't you?

so a reduction in the rise of spending is a vicious cut. As pointed out above we spent close to the EU average and still have worse outcomes.

Thing about budgets is that they get cut every year in private enterprise. People make do with less and do more.

The NHS needs reform not feeding more money. This panic happens every year and the NHS tries to use it to hit the government over the head.

If we have bed blockers then do something about them, maybe drop them off at the council office with a few off duty nurses during a quiet period? Make sure the press are invited.

printing money is effective devaluing the currency and borrowing off the savers. Yes your pension will be worth less. Sorry if that is hard to understand.

[shaunbhoy]

The money needs to be found today for the costs.

Indeed. Time for the current working generations to step up to the plate and provide this cash then.

This might come a lot more naturally to a great many of them if they were not such a mollycoddled self-indulgent selection of ingrates.

Those being asked to foot this bill on behalf of the generations that raised them into such a privileged society might want to spend some time reflecting upon the huge debt that they owe in this regard.

They have been born into a free western society where war, disease, and hunger are pretty much things of the past.

They have been offered educational opportunities that their forebears could only have dreamed about. And whilst spending 2-3 days a week scraping a pass in some worthless Degree Course, they run up prodigious bills which they will, in all probability never repay.

One wonders what the fallout will be when it inevitably transpires that THEIR children find out that they have inherited this Bill in years to come?

Yet despite all of this, they consistently carp about the hopelessness of their plight whilst routinely taking "Gap Years" to "Find Themselves".

Ironically, the costs of this are regularly footed by the very generation that they now routinely castigate as the root cause of their predicament when it really boils down to the fact that they have never been required to make any concessions or compromises, and are thus ill-prepared to face the challenges that lie ahead of them.

They feel they have some right to spend all of their money enlarging their earlobes and upgrading their phones whilst festooning themselves with a predictable selection of puerile tattoos.

This sense of entitlement is reinforced by the selfish opinions of like-minded imbeciles, the sort that they make sure to surround themselves with on their little whining entitlement bubbles on Facebook etc.

Come on snowflakes, you can run but you cannot hide. Time to MTFU and put your puny shoulders to the wheel.
Some of us Boomers have incontinence issues looming and botties won't wipe themselves you know!!

HTH

[tiggat]

the figures on the graphs were adjusted for inflation. It says it at the bottom.

Obviously voting for the MRLP or the greens means you can't read.

If you read them we spend in real times far more than we did, we spend about average in the EU as a percentage. Lower than France & Germany but we still get worse outcomes.
.

How dense are you exactly? Do you really need it to be spelt out to you that other factors (such as reduced social care spending and general public health spending) have increased demand for NHS services more than 1.5%?

we spend about average in the EU as a percentage.
.

wrong

So no its not a cut. If I go into the boss and ask for a 20% pay cut and walk out with 5% and inflation is 3% you have not had a pay cut. Labour threw billions at the problem unfortunately we didn't have those billions, Labour borrowed them we are still paying them off.
.

Ya see the NHS budget is exactly the same as when you go into your boss and ask for a raise
.

Typical Tory misunderstanding and simplism of economics.

Labour threw billions at the problem unfortunately we didn't have those billions, Labour borrowed them we are still paying them off.
.

You understand that governments can literally print money don't you?

[WTFH]

WTFH - The point made about a growing elderly population is significant as they are a significant part of the cost and its going to get much worse. Action is needed now to solve it.

I agree with you, which is why the comments about “they’ve already paid for it over 50 years when they worked” provide no solution to the problem. The money needs to be found today for the costs.

[vetran]

Somebody doesn't understand how inflation works
I wouldn't expect any other understanding of basic economics from a Tory

the figures on the graphs were adjusted for inflation. It says it at the bottom.

Obviously voting for the MRLP or the greens means you can't read.

If you read them we spend in real times far more than we did, we spend about average in the EU as a percentage. Lower than France & Germany but we still get worse outcomes.

So no its not a cut. If I go into the boss and ask for a 20% pay rise and walk out with 5% and inflation is 3% you have not had a pay cut. Labour threw billions at the problem unfortunately we didn't have those billions, Labour borrowed them we are still paying them off.

WTFH - The point made about a growing elderly population is significant as they are a significant part of the cost and its going to get much worse. Action is needed now to solve it.

[stonehenge]

Dementia will be cured in 10 years.

It sounds like you've got it already.

[tiggat]

this was actually quite interesting.

10 charts that show why the NHS is in trouble - BBC News

Graph 1 makes a mockery of accusations of vicious Tory cuts.

Somebody doesn't understand how inflation works
I wouldn't expect any other understanding of basic economics from a Tory

[minestrone]

Dementia will be cured in 10 years.

We'll be the generation trapped in decrepit bodies but still posting tulip on CUK into our 90s with our 1 remaining working finger.

[stonehenge]

My wife was in hospital a few years ago and the surgical ward was full of dementia patients. There was nowhere else to put them.

None of them needed to be in hospital but the problem was finding anywhere to discharge them to.

They were a nightmare for staff and patients recovering from surgery. Slept all day, then like the walking dead at night.

My wife couldn't get out of there fast enough.

[Smartie]

No, that's another Government lie to divert attention from the real predominant reason for pressures on the NHS - Uncontrolled immigration from Thirld World sh*tholes ( (c) Donald Trump )

Think you mean reducing pressures by working for the NHS ;-)

[OwlHoot]

We are constantly told that the pressures on the NHS are down to an elderly population...

No, that's another Government lie to divert attention from the real predominant reason for pressures on the NHS - Uncontrolled immigration from Thirld World sh*tholes ( (c) Donald Trump )

[BrilloPad]

So, what are our priorities?

More importantly, how are the priorities decided?

I think I should play admin on the human race.....

[Smartie]

Cost

Through the advances of medical science we can cure more and more medical problems, help to prevent others and mitigate the impact of even more.
Pick the average 70 year old up and shake them and they rattle due to the ever increasing number of daily tablets they're on for a variety of ailments including diabetes, blood pressure as well as more exotic stuff.

Drugs are expensive - sometimes tens of thousands of pounds per year, per patient. Even drugs out of patent can get more, not less, expensive.
Cancer drugs price rise 'costing NHS millions' - BBC News

This means that we can keep people alive long enough to enjoy new and previously novel ailments such as Alzheimer's when they require massively increased social care (though they usually don't get it at the moment).

As we know, 'You can't put a price on life' (TM). So, even though we do some rationing it's nowhere near enough to mitigate the increasing costs compared to the budget.

As politicians might say, 'we need a conversation' about this. People need to make decisions about what they're prepared to pay for the NHS/medical treatment and what they expect in return. At the moment, most people want everything included but don't want to pay any more for it. So, what's it to be? An extra 20p in the pound tax or severely restricted services?

Personally I think we should be looking at a European style partial insurance system. The NHS looks pretty medieval in many respects compared to the French system for instance.

I know people who work in the NHS and the burdens placed upon them at the moment are not sustainable for much longer. Then again, I know people in education and you could say the same thing. They're also cutting the defence budget by the looks of it.

So, what are our priorities?

[shaunbhoy]

My original comment was in response to the title of the thread "The ageing population myth", where I was trying to point out that it wasn't a myth that the ageing population was costing the country more.

Well xog's original figures would seem to dispute that somewhat. Although taking into account your limited intellect, I doubt you understood what it was that he was portraying.

The fact is that a larger proportion of today's NHS budget is spent on a small group of people.

Yeah. Bloody kids, and most of them haven't even started paying NI either. Never mind though, when WTFH's Party get into power you can always outlaw them! That'd save a few quid.
Maybe you could even get that much-needed personality implant then?

The title of this thread says that is a myth. My alternative facts say it isn't.

FTFY