Reply to: Milk is inhumane

[OwlHoot]

I don't reckon it's the slightest bit cruel to cows, but as they can't speak we can never be entirely sure.

So as an alternative why not pay prolific women milkers if they're up for it?

2017-07-26 Mom-of-two who produces ten times as much breastmilk as the average woman reveals she has donated 600 GALLONS in two years, after pumping for FIVE HOURS every single day

Elisabeth Anderson-Sierra, 29, has Hyperlactation Syndrome, which means that her body produces up to 1.75 gallons of milk every day.

[SueEllen]

oi the sky fairy's friend says it was.

Which one?

[Jog On]

You can have your opinion/theory about what humans should or should not eat, but if you're going to make claims about how other animals act, at least get the facts right.
Hyena are scavengers. They do not eat living creatures. They scavenge dead flesh, either by finding it or by chasing other hunters off it. Their noses are tuned to pick up the smell of blood and rotting flesh.
Their top speed is about 60km/h, whereas the three remaining subspecies of Nanger all manage at least 80km/h

Or, to put it another way, the idea of a "pack of hyenas eating baby gazelles alive" isn't something that would happen.

Point about hyenas is that they eat animals alive without bothering to kill them first - I cited this to illustrate the brutality of nature and 'how things are'.

This post is not about "what humans should or should not eat" it is about how humans treat the animals we eat/harvest. The ethics around mass production and factory farming is the topic I thought we were discussing here.

Like I said in an earlier post - I will eat cheese and eggs from the local butchers because I know the animals are not reared in cages that do not give them enough room to turn around, they get to see the light of day and are cared for and looked after.

What happens to the animals in those mass produced farms is a problem for me therefor I choose not to give them my custom. It's treating them like raw commodities on a production line after spending their entire lives in the same conditions that the Iraqi army are now keeping ISIS prisoners that I don't agree with. It least the ISIS terrorists have done something to deserve it.

[vetran]

It's worth pointing out that the human gut isn't designed.

oi the sky fairy's friend says it was.

[northernladyuk]

It's also worth pointing out that the human gut is designed for processing proteins and fats, it's not so good at processing carbohydrates. Most creatures that only eat carbs have a digestive track adapted to do so. Ours isn't. When humans eat too many carbs, it leads to diseases such as diabetes and weight gain, because carbs are inefficient for the human digestive system.
The way some people get round that is by taking multiple tablets or unnatural chemical foodstuffs to try to make up for the lack of good proteins and fats in their diet.
As humans it is only in the last few decades that these chemicals have been used, as yet there are no trials showing the long term effects of them and the human race has not adapted to them.
I would rather eat a natural, balanced, seasonal diet, than one that requires unnatural chemicals, or causes a massive drain on the world's resources while wiping out species, but all to keep some people happy who then want to scorn anyone who wants to live healthily with a natural diet.

You get your milk flown half way round the world. I get my eggs from the bottom of my garden (rehomed ex-batts)

It's worth pointing out that the human gut isn't designed.

[WTFH]

It's also worth pointing out that the human gut is designed for processing proteins and fats, it's not so good at processing carbohydrates. Most creatures that only eat carbs have a digestive track adapted to do so. Ours isn't. When humans eat too many carbs, it leads to diseases such as diabetes and weight gain, because carbs are inefficient for the human digestive system.
The way some people get round that is by taking multiple tablets or unnatural chemical foodstuffs to try to make up for the lack of good proteins and fats in their diet.
As humans it is only in the last few decades that these chemicals have been used, as yet there are no trials showing the long term effects of them and the human race has not adapted to them.
I would rather eat a natural, balanced, seasonal diet, than one that requires unnatural chemicals, or causes a massive drain on the world's resources while wiping out species, but all to keep some people happy who then want to scorn anyone who wants to live healthily with a natural diet.

You get your milk flown half way round the world. I get my eggs from the bottom of my garden (rehomed ex-batts)

[northernladyuk]

You can have your opinion/theory about what humans should or should not eat, but if you're going to make claims about how other animals act, at least get the facts right.

You still haven't got the hang of this, have you?

[Bee]

linky



Fecking snowflakes.

I drink milk a lot, I'm worse than a Dutch.

[WTFH]

This is where personal feelings on how animals are treated differ. I understand that it's been our part in the food chain since forever and that nature is brutal when it comes to packs of hyenas eating baby gazelles alive

You can have your opinion/theory about what humans should or should not eat, but if you're going to make claims about how other animals act, at least get the facts right.
Hyena are scavengers. They do not eat living creatures. They scavenge dead flesh, either by finding it or by chasing other hunters off it. Their noses are tuned to pick up the smell of blood and rotting flesh.
Their top speed is about 60km/h, whereas the three remaining subspecies of Nanger all manage at least 80km/h

Or, to put it another way, the idea of a "pack of hyenas eating baby gazelles alive" isn't something that would happen.

[Jog On]

Breeding animals for the purpose of eating them and their byproducts is 'just the way it is'. It is the circle of life. If we didn't do it, there wouldn't be fields of cows, pigs, sheep or whatever just roaming freely at no risk of death-by-human (if they did, it would be death-by-somethingelse instead). More likely, they'd just be largely extinct as a species - we'd need the land, and more, to grow the necessary vegetables and fruits and whatever instead. Arguably, the extra land required would be even more of a problem. That might be a moot point, as humans would probably be extinct because the lions and monkeys would have killed us off for being too stupid.

Eating meat is natural. Our guts are designed that way. And we're clever enough to do it intelligently.

Veganism is moronic nonsense, and it goes against our biological construction.

How odd. I saw that and thought - oh, that's how chicken's are mass farmed somewhere in East Asia. Doesn't seem particularly brutal, just efficient.

I had some minke whale in Iceland a few years ago. Interesting flavour.

This is where personal feelings on how animals are treated differ. I understand that it's been our part in the food chain since forever and that nature is brutal when it comes to packs of hyenas eating baby gazelles alive - but I personally find the level of intelligence and efficiency unacceptable and choose not to partake in it.

It's the disregard and blocking out of the fact that these are sentient beings that feel pain, fear and unthinkable suffering. If you have pets imagine your beloved cat/dog going through that. Do you not feel anything at all?

I have no doubt that soon the whole process will be automated and abattoirs will be like car factories with robots doing all the 'work'. Yay - look how far we've come.

This is an argument that neither side will back down on, so I'm happy to just carry on as I am and you lot can eat WTF you like.

[SueEllen]

Breeding animals for the purpose of eating them and their byproducts is 'just the way it is'. It is the circle of life. If we didn't do it, there wouldn't be fields of cows, pigs, sheep or whatever just roaming freely at no risk of death-by-human (if they did, it would be death-by-somethingelse instead). More likely, they'd just be largely extinct as a species - we'd need the land, and more, to grow the necessary vegetables and fruits and whatever instead. Arguably, the extra land required would be even more of a problem. That might be a moot point, as humans would probably be extinct because the lions and monkeys would have killed us off for being too stupid.

Eating meat is natural. Our guts are designed that way. And we're clever enough to do it intelligently.

Veganism is moronic nonsense, and it goes against our biological construction.

What vegans and some vegetarians refuse to understand people's genes originate from different parts of the world. You can't undo centuries of eating particular foods such as animal products and expect all people to be healthy.

So expecting the Inuit for example to not eat meat and animal products when a Western type diet high in carbohydrates are causing them health problems is laughable especially as they can't afford the plentiful fruit and veg you get in lots of other climates.

[NotAllThere]

... I decided to stop eating meat after seeing this video...

How odd. I saw that and thought - oh, that's how chicken's are mass farmed somewhere in East Asia. Doesn't seem particularly brutal, just efficient.

I had some minke whale in Iceland a few years ago. Interesting flavour.

[vetran]

Whale?

Nah Seafood & eat it apparently.

[chopper]

Breeding animals for the purpose of eating them and their byproducts is 'just the way it is'. It is the circle of life. If we didn't do it, there wouldn't be fields of cows, pigs, sheep or whatever just roaming freely at no risk of death-by-human (if they did, it would be death-by-somethingelse instead). More likely, they'd just be largely extinct as a species - we'd need the land, and more, to grow the necessary vegetables and fruits and whatever instead. Arguably, the extra land required would be even more of a problem. That might be a moot point, as humans would probably be extinct because the lions and monkeys would have killed us off for being too stupid.

Eating meat is natural. Our guts are designed that way. And we're clever enough to do it intelligently.

Veganism is moronic nonsense, and it goes against our biological construction.

[Jog On]

My issue with the likes of almond milk, coconut milk, etc, is that while they might be more ethically friendly to UK animals, how environmentally friendly are they to produce and ship? It's a bit like palm oil - who cares if orangutans are wiped out as long as your toothpaste goes foamy when you brush.

From what I've read about almond milk:

• 80% of almonds are produced in California
• It takes a lot of water to grow almonds (California was until recently having a water crisis)
• The pesticides used on the crops kill bees

So problems I see here are based around the most developed nation in the world figuring out how to distribute water around their country if one of their states is in crisis - and their agricultural practices using bee killing pesticides.

Almond milk bad for environment? Tom Philpott and Mother Jones are wrong.

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeands...for-the-planet

I will continue enjoy my almond milk

Palm oil is another matter - try looking for products free of that, even in well to do 'organic' health shops...