Reply to: Supermarkets do not sell unlabelled halal meat

[NotAllThere]

I think it's a disgrace - taking away the livelihoods of kosher/halal small businesses like that.

[SueEllen]

Interesting comment on a Telegraph article from someone who claims to be a farmer (tl;dr - find out what abattoir the meat came from and make sure it doesn't have halal certifiction)

So only buy from an abattoir that also kills pigs.

[PurpleGorilla]

Interesting comment on a Telegraph article from someone who claims to be a farmer (tl;dr - find out what abattoir the meat came from and make sure it doesn't have halal certifiction)

Thanks for sharing.

[Gumbo Robot]

Find a good butcher and get your meat from them, they should be able to tell you where its from. On the plus side make friends with them and if there is a war you are sure to get the prime cut instead of the usual ration crap.

Stock up on nylons too, works a treat with the ladies. Learn from history!

Interesting comment on a Telegraph article from someone who claims to be a farmer (tl;dr - find out what abattoir the meat came from and make sure it doesn't have halal certifiction)

The people who write these articles don't understand how the meat industry currently operates in this country. In order for meat to be sold as "halal", most big abattoirs and food companies join a certification scheme run by a number of Muslims bodies. The requirement of these self-appointed Muslim clerics are that the entire production line in an abattoir is dedicated to halal production, stunned or non-stunned. So the big abattoir companies in the UK ( which supply supermarkets and slaughter 50% of the 14 million lamb and sheep killed for food each year in this country) have to run their entire production as halal in order for any of the meat to "qualify" as halal for the Muslim consumer. A fee for certification is paid for each animal slaughtered, and these Muslims certification bodies ( usually run as charities for tax purposes) donate a percentage of their fee income to Islamic Charities, many of which have been suspected by the US and UK Governments of being connected with the possible support of terrorism.

This is why the meat you buy in the supermarkets is halal, whether you like it or not.
The decision on whether to stun an animal in accordance with the law is made by the abattoir depending on their customer requirements, with no need to justify the numbers subjected to non-stun slaughter nor the religious beliefs of the final consumer. Many abattoirs have told me they will perform non-stun slaughter merely if asked - one told me that they do it because there is nothing in the enforcement of the law to stop them, despite it being very clear that the exemption from the legal requirement to stun is " by Jews and Muslims for the food of Jews and Muslims". They can also slaughter without stunning for the export market, despite the intention of the exemption from the legal requirement to stun being for domestic UK consumption only.

As a Soil Association organic beef and sheep farmer, I take great care with the rearing of my animals and have discovered that once my animals arrive at an abattoir which is "halal certified"as well as Soil Association certified, I cannot guarantee that they will be stunned correctly prior to being killed by bleeding out, as that decision rests solely in the hands of the abattoir. It is worse if I sell my animals at market, as I have no idea where the buyer will send them for slaughter. I also found that an abattoir can register itself as Red Tractor Assured, Soil Association assured ( both of which require stunning prior to slaughter) merely by slaughtering a handful of animals correctly and there is no control over the extent of non-stun slaughter for the remainder of their production, which can be tens of thousands a week in a big abattoir. Also, labelling meat as Halal does not differentiate between stunned or non-stunned.

There are moves in the meat and livestock industry to force the farmers, livestock hauliers and feed manufacturers to be certified as "Halal Compliant", with a payment of a fee to the Islamic Certification bodies, to make the entire supply chain Halal, not just the slaughter process.

In my opinion as a farmer, to protect the good name of English Beef and Lamb, non-stun slaughter must be banned, and Halal certified slaughter stopped for the mainstream meat supply chain.

[stek]

Halal (and Kosher) killing does seem a bit medieval.

Used to walk past Bolton Abattoir when I was a kid, the screams from the animals was horrendous.

Not put me off bacon though...

[woohoo]

Find a good butcher and get your meat from them, they should be able to tell you where its from. On the plus side make friends with them and if there is a war you are sure to get the prime cut instead of the usual ration crap.

Stock up on nylons too, works a treat with the ladies. Learn from history!

[xoggoth]

Everyone should have the information they need to make their own choices.

[darmstadt]

Blimey, its true...

[PurpleGorilla]

Halal (and Kosher) killing does seem a bit medieval.

I seem to recall reading pretty much all NZ lamb is halal killed.

[PurpleGorilla]

It means that the chances are it has had its throat slit whilst still conscious.

I wish to avoid that meat but I am not given the information by the supermarkets to do so. So I just don't buy meat from them.

Halal (and Kosher) killing does seem a bit medieval.

[original PM]

Just like this post?

Normally I would agree with you but not this time.

[vetran]

I would prefer to eat Meat that has suffered as little as possible, my understanding is that means stunned. If that isn't the case then lets investigate & change it not substitute that for slitting its throat because its cheap.


I don't really care if someone has spoken religious words over the animal but I can see how that may offend others who believe in other faiths or versions of the same faith. Therefore those blessed in any way should be clearly marked.

[Gumbo Robot]

The only stuff I can find out about this are old Dail Sieg Heil articles but going to the source:

Sainsburys | What is your position on halal meat?

Under no circumstances would any of our own brand meat be from an animal that has not been stunned prior to slaughter

Weasel words. Many animal welfare groups claim that the stunning only immobilses the animal not render it unconscious. E.g this from CIWF on halal chicken:

In practice the stunning being used only serves to immobilise and not render the birds unconscious, making the suffering even worse.

[Flashman]

From those well known extreme right wing islamaphobes....

Religious slaughter - Slaughter - Farm animals

What is the RSPCA doing?

We’re pressing for law changes to improve animal welfare at slaughter. Until this occurs, we propose:
•UK Jewish and Muslim communities review their slaughter practices

•Meat produced from animals not stunned before slaughter should be clearly labelled to allow consumer choice.

No doubt the law should be changed but as food labelling is an EU competence don't hold your breath...

[darmstadt]

Tesco, Asda, Sainsburys et al are all selling unstunned, ritually slaughtered meat without telling you.

That's because any meat from the hindquarters is considered haram, not halal and will enter the normal distribution channels, so that nice juicy rump sreak you're having for dinner....

Maybe you don't give a toss but for those of us that do, isn't it about time for a requirement for packaging to clearly state the provenance of what's inside?

Meanwhile, I eat less and less meat & when I do I get it from the local butcher where all the meat comes from the local abattoir.

Anyhow, just another 1200 sigs needed

The only stuff I can find out about this are old Dail Sieg Heil articles but going to the source:

Sainsburys | What is your position on halal meat?

What is your position on halal meat?

In line with our high welfare standards, all the animals used for our own brand meat are stunned prior to slaughter.

Under no circumstances would any of our own brand meat be from an animal that has not been stunned prior to slaughter. The animal will always be treated humanely with the utmost respect. In New Zealand it is common for lamb to be blessed however we have never requested this and all of our own brand meat is from animals stunned prior to slaughter so it would be wrong to label our own brand meat as Halal.

We do sell a selection of branded halal and kosher products in some stores, all of which is very clearly labelled.