Reply to: Why is everyone so hung up on timesheets?

[GazCol]

timesheets, even when I’m direct with a client I’ll send something over to the business area responsible for signing off my invoices to sign a timesheet in excel to confirm days worked that week – for a couple of minutes admin every week it solves a lot of problems if it comes to an invoice dispute due to days worked, especially if days are worked out of normal office hours (weekends, bank holidays, etc)

[PerfectStorm]

I do the same. What's the point of putting hours worked, when on a daily rate?

Depends on the preferences of the client/agency; I guess some would like to ensure that a working day is, infact, being work.

My one stipulates to only enter a working day, and otherwise ensure that I'm doing my hours per week (though doesn't specify times or a location - nod to IR35 there).

[Contreras]

I like them. Signed or approved timesheets are a formal record of work done as accepted by the client. That way, if they don't pay an invoice then it's far easier for me to get my money out of them.

This ^^ is the only reason that I bother chasing for signed timesheets.

[Batcher]

But if your on a Hourly rate you "could" put an extra few hours on the time sheet to make up for the bank holiday

You could but it wouldn't be ethical or, in fact, legal.

[CloudWalker]

You'd be surprised how many managers just sign the time sheets with out checking.
But I suppose it depends on if your on a day rate or hourly rate, as If your on a daily rate there's no real way to claim for the bank holidays as the time sheet will show just 4 x days worked.
But if your on a Hourly rate you "could" put an extra few hours on the time sheet to make up for the bank holiday

[Taita]

It seems to be taken for granted that every contractor has to get timesheets signed weekly, is this actually the case and if so why? I currently don't have to do this with any of my clients but reading CUK, it's standard practice and seems a bit out of place, akin to factory workers punching in/out on their shifts.

Is it an IR35 thing, something that's simply tradition in the UK contracting market, or what?

It is traditional and predates IR35 by the best part of 30 years if not longer. It is an audit trail which is very useful to supplier and user (agency & client). I have also worked on sites that used mechanical/electronic time recording systems.

I cannot think why I would object and I have never been professionally advised that using a timesheet/work-carried-out record would compromise my IR35 position.

That said, it is not unknown for timesheets to be submitted and authorised for ghosts (non-existent workers) . :

[Sausage Surprise]

I find it odd, too. The manager that signs mine is in another building and always asks for them to be submitted on a Thursday so he can sign all of his 'group' together on a Friday. Technically, that means I could take every Friday off and he a. would never know and b. has already signed it off.

Also, this is the first one I've had where I have to complete number of hours worked, rather than just tick a box for the day. I always put 7.5 hours, regardless of whether I've worked 5 hours or 10. It is, really, complete balderdash.

I do the same. What's the point of putting hours worked, when on a daily rate?

[vwdan]

Just seems to be a natural consequence of working a day-rate to me. I don't mind them - they're signed off while everything fresh and protects me from someone kicking off six weeks down the line accusing me of not turning up or something.

Not everyone seems to want them or they have different opinions on their importance, but I can't say it bothers me.

[JRCT]

I find it odd, too. The manager that signs mine is in another building and always asks for them to be submitted on a Thursday so he can sign all of his 'group' together on a Friday. Technically, that means I could take every Friday off and he a. would never know and b. has already signed it off.

Also, this is the first one I've had where I have to complete number of hours worked, rather than just tick a box for the day. I always put 7.5 hours, regardless of whether I've worked 5 hours or 10. It is, really, complete balderdash.

[d000hg]

It's one of the things I hated most about contracting. Having to go bother some senior person at the end of the week, or on a Monday morning (or I would miss the deadline for the week) with "can you sign this?". Half the time the person signing wasn't around all week to know if I was there or not. Factory workers have clocking machines so as not to waste manager's time on such trivialities.

If you were all working the way you claim to work, work would be approved when you

Yeah, my feelings which motivated the question - it doesn't seem very business-y. In fact having to get approval on such a granular level is almost D&C

[VectraMan]

It's one of the things I hated most about contracting. Having to go bother some senior person at the end of the week, or on a Monday morning (or I would miss the deadline for the week) with "can you sign this?". Half the time the person signing wasn't around all week to know if I was there or not. Factory workers have clocking machines so as not to waste manager's time on such trivialities.

If you were all working the way you claim to work, work would be approved when you reached certain milestones in a project. Nobody would be having to agree to your hours.

I don't think the contractors here use timesheets. But then they also don't get paid via an agent.

[TheFaQQer]

One agency I was working through had a clause on their timesheet which said something like "I confirm that the hours / days above have been worked to my satisfaction, and the agency can invoice us at the agreed rate" which saves any argument later about whether the work was done or was good enough.

At the moment, I now have an online timesheet to complete each week, but that doesn't link to my invoice in any way.

[craig1]

I like them. Signed or approved timesheets are a formal record of work done as accepted by the client. That way, if they don't pay an invoice then it's far easier for me to get my money out of them.

On a side-note on this, one way I can tell a good consultancy or supplier providing day-rate work is if they provide me with a Work In Progress summary regularly. The dodgy ones often get huffy about it because it's far harder for them to hide extra bits of in there then invoice it a good bit down the line when people can't clearly remember exactly what was done.

[mudskipper]

Agency needs them.

Given that I invoice monthly to a day rate, I redesigned their standard one which was weekly and had start and finished times each day for a one which just has

1-2 Apr - 2 days
5-9 Apr - 4 days

etc.


Both client and agency are happy - saves me hassling client every week for a sig.

[SpontaneousOrder]

Timesheets can be needed too, especially if they are itemised to a degree, in order to capitalise costs for tax purposes. I.e. time I spend working on building a new feature is capitalisable.