Reply to: New analyst role

[eek]

This is why you are not ready to be a contractor. Stay permie.

Saying that reading through this thread I think the only answer ir feedback you are willing to listen to is 'Great stuff. Go for it.' so.... Great stuff go for it.

+1. Can you come back and tell us how it went. We need another source of Suity type stories.....

[northernladuk]

Sorry for the dumb questions.
where the best place to get a proper contract? new client being the same as before but calling them a different name?

This is why you are not ready to be a contractor. Stay permie.

Saying that reading through this thread I think the only answer ir feedback you are willing to listen to is 'Great stuff. Go for it.' so.... Great stuff go for it.

[DirtyDog]

the 24 month is something else i would need to look into, however my location has changed a few times and I've only been in my current location for 5 months but with the trust for more than 24 months, does this make a difference?

It's an irrelevance. You can only claim expenses to a temporary location. If you are only doing this one role (whether through an umbrella or a Ltd) the location isn't temporary.

[Bellona]

OP knows they're caught by IR35.

If the plan was to hand in notice to take a break, and the opportunity to get a few quid in the bank first has come along, they'd be daft not to.

+1

[dbred10]

I did miss that bit out, i would be continue to research during step 1-4 as I am very new to this.

the 24 month is something else i would need to look into, however my location has changed a few times and I've only been in my current location for 5 months but with the trust for more than 24 months, does this make a difference?

going through an agency - This might be the only option to the organisation, if their HR says you can only employ interim staff via an agency then I would have to do this.

If the agency doesnt put my name forward then the trust may not want to go via them, they might want to go via another agency who will put my name forward. The agency might just get the referrers fee for doing not a lot as it's the trust and I who know what we want. i'm sure some agency would want an easy life but then again, im new and some things may not be as simple as I thought.

[DirtyDog]

Sticking with the contracting theme my steps are the following..
1) Set up a ltd company/find a decent accountant/open a business account
2) get a decent written contract (any advise where I could do this or is it something you guys would just make one up as watertight as possible?)
3) Go to an agency and tell them my client and I want to go through you for payment
4) When it comes to self assessment / rax return deadline contact my accountant and give them all my paperwork

3) You don't need to use an agency, if your employer will take you direct via your own limited company.
4) Depends if you pay the accountant to do your personal tax return for you or not - some do it included in the company fee, some charge extra. Make sure you know what to expect

To be honest, doing this for a 2 month contract isn't worthwhile unless you are on a whacking great rate, which I suspect you aren't. It's not worth the hassle, go umbrella.

If I went via an umbrella co.
1) get a decent written contract (any advise where I could do this or is it something you guys would just make one up as watertight as possible?)
2) Go to an agency and tell them my client and I want to go through you for payment (personal bank?)

1) Ask the umbrella - they would be your employer.
2) Why do you need an agency? They wouldn't pay your personal bank - they pay the umbrella, umbrella pays you (after tax and charges).

If you are going umbrella, make sure your employer knows that this is your only role, so will impact expenses that you can claim. Do no claim expenses that you aren't allowed to claim - it will be painful when you get caught.

[DirtyDog]

Others will have a view but are you sure that when you go to an agency they wont just try to put someone else forward who may be cheaper than you and take their usual margin? There seems to be some pretty sharp practice around.

That's always a risk. But if the employer wants the OP, then they will take them anyway.

[socialworker]

Others will have a view but are you sure that when you go to an agency they wont just try to put someone else forward who may be cheaper than you and take their usual margin? There seems to be some pretty sharp practice around.

[malvolio]

Could I ask another newbie question

So I'm planning to go ahead with this 'contracting' role which is in the same organisation. What if they decided to put me in a specific department e.g deal with all emergency admissions rather than look after the whole service the trust provider (emergency, out-aptients, maternity etc)?
Would this be still the same in terms of the IR35 or is this a project and it can be seen as something different to before?

Sticking with the contracting theme my steps are the following..
1) Set up a ltd company/find a decent accountant/open a business account
2) get a decent written contract (any advise where I could do this or is it something you guys would just make one up as watertight as possible?)
3) Go to an agency and tell them my client and I want to go through you for payment
4) When it comes to self assessment / rax return deadline contact my accountant and give them all my paperwork

If I went via an umbrella co.
1) get a decent written contract (any advise where I could do this or is it something you guys would just make one up as watertight as possible?)
2) Go to an agency and tell them my client and I want to go through you for payment (personal bank?)

For someone who's done a lot of reading, you seem not to have learned very much...

IR35 not (not "the IR35", incidentally) is about Direction and Control, primarily. Where you work and what you do doesn't come into it.

Opening a Limited company for two months is a waste of everyone's time and money.

If you go umbrella, you're an employee. Let the umbrella worry about contracts.

And ignore expenses. You won't be eligible for any either under the single permanent workplace and/or the 24 month rules - and no, I'm not explaining why, I'll leave that as an exercise for you..

[dbred10]

Could I ask another newbie question

So I'm planning to go ahead with this 'contracting' role which is in the same organisation. What if they decided to put me in a specific department e.g deal with all emergency admissions rather than look after the whole service the trust provider (emergency, out-aptients, maternity etc)?
Would this be still the same in terms of the IR35 or is this a project and it can be seen as something different to before?

Sticking with the contracting theme my steps are the following..
1) Set up a ltd company/find a decent accountant/open a business account
2) get a decent written contract (any advise where I could do this or is it something you guys would just make one up as watertight as possible?)
3) Go to an agency and tell them my client and I want to go through you for payment
4) When it comes to self assessment / rax return deadline contact my accountant and give them all my paperwork

If I went via an umbrella co.
1) get a decent written contract (any advise where I could do this or is it something you guys would just make one up as watertight as possible?)
2) Go to an agency and tell them my client and I want to go through you for payment (personal bank?)

[SueEllen]

what should it be under?
I do want to take up their offer but if it's not contracting what is it?
They are unable for one reason or another to offer me more money as a perm but they're happy to pay me more money as a contractor.

I understand it gives contractors a bad name but the truth is, im happy to pay my full tax etc, but its the employer who's offering this to me.

They give you more money as a contractor because it's easier to get rid of you, they don't pay into your pension, they don't pay your sick pay, don't pay your training etc.

I've managed to see the benefits package some of my larger clients give their employees and it's only when they have someone who needs a lot of sick leave do you realise how much you are on your own if you are a contractor. Though you tend to be better of as a contractor than working for a small company as a permie.

I'm suggest you use an umbrella company as you may find you don't like contracting.

[dbred10]

what should it be under?
I do want to take up their offer but if it's not contracting what is it?
They are unable for one reason or another to offer me more money as a perm but they're happy to pay me more money as a contractor.

I understand it gives contractors a bad name but the truth is, im happy to pay my full tax etc, but its the employer who's offering this to me.

[Wanderer]

This is not contracting - it's just doing the same job under a different legal framework.

Agreed. Contract or don't contract, but don't do this Friday to Monday permie to contract thing. Giving up permie rights to become a contractor is something that the government specifically wants to discourage and doing it gives contractors a bad name

[jamesbrown]

This is not contracting - it's just doing the same job under a different legal framework.

Yep.

[jamesbrown]

Yes I am bound to get caught by the IR35, but do I need to declare this first or just be honest and wait to be caught if I am getting my own company up? It's just being inside the IR35 is still better than umbrella company.

No, you don't wait, you need to account for being inside on this contract upfront, which (in simple terms) means 5% expenses and PAYE on the rest. Failing to account for this upfront, when you know you're inside, could result in significant penalties. Given your lack of experience, you'd need an accountant to arrange everything for you. TBH, you say that you'll be better of with a company, but it's pretty marginal when all (i.e. one) contracts are inside and you'll also have the hassle of opening, managing and closing the company. With an umbrella, you're an employee of the umbrella, which will operate PAYE on the contract income, so much less hassle, but slightly less income than a Ltd. after accounting for flat rate VAT etc. (which will be included in the IR35 calc.)