Reply to: Advise on rate in Switzerland please

[killerbackhand]

Swiss IT contract sitaution

Yes the rates have dived owing to the banks losing their secrecy advantages due to the Americans, a possible oversupply of people from Europe and India.
Only within specialist skills e.g. Murex or some SAP modules HANA? would you be commanding 1k+ figures in CHF.

I left a SAP project paying over chf1k+ but the company decided to pay peanuts , got monkies and are now suffering.
They never learn.

[BlasterBates]

You can live live fairly cheaply.

I lived near Zürich. I found it more expensive but not that much more.

Apartment 1100 CHF per month
Chinese take away 14 CHF
Kebab CHF 10
Petrol, roughly what you pay anywhere.
The cheap hotel nearby was CHF 80 per night.

I would look at homegate.ch | Immobilien, Wohnung, Wohnungen oder Haus suchen und finden. to get an idea about rents.

THe main expense is rent and they are hideously expensive in the desirable areas and darn cheap once you're outside the city, and eating out in a posh restaurant costs a lot, but then there are much cheaper self service restaurants, and plenty of bars where a beer is 6 CHF.

I think the problem is that if your English and don't speak the lingo you end up in the really expensive hotel, and find yourself in the city centre somewhere where prices are horrendous.

[sunflower]

GreyWolf is right about choosing your own lifestyle. Fresh fish is really expensive compared to other countries and fruit and vegies.

As another reader commented, CHF 500 is like the Swiss perm salary and with that, they get some pretty good benefits. One friend of mine even got a decent priced flat for him and his family for a while via the employer (huge co and they owned some apartment blocks).

[GreyWolf]

As a few have said above, CHF 750 to CHF 900 is more like what a contract developer should be getting. CHF 500 is worse than permie money.

If you are an EU citizen there is no need to worry about the permit issue. You have two weeks after arrival to take your contract, passport and address details down to the Gemeinde where they will issue you a permit. It is a formality for EU citizens (excepting some of the newer members) because Switzerland has signed up to the free movement of people agreement. EU citizens have the same right to work here as the Swiss. The tales of it taking months are either from non-EU people or from 10 or more years ago.

Yes, it is expensive here. However, a lot comes down to lifestyle. If you eat excusively in restaurants, never let a vegetable pass your lips and feel that no night is complete without 10 pints then you are screwed. On the other hand, if you are capable of cooking up a balanced diet for yourself then it's not so bad. Just don't think about how much you're paying for beer. From Basel you can also shop over the border where it is much cheaper, subject to customs limits.

Some things are actually cheaper here such as electrical goods. Sales tax is around, I think, around 8% (or possibly 11%) versus 20% VAT in the UK. It's hard to make a clear comparison though as they don't apply it to the same things.

Income tax varies from canton to canton and I have no idea about Basel Stadt. It'll be better than the UK though, so the key is to get yourself out of the UK tax system. Also, bear in mind that there is pretty much one tax bill issued by the canton tax office that covers federal tax, cantonal tax and sometimes gemeinde tax. There are no separate bills such as council tax, or water rates (not for me anyway, other cantons and towns may be different) and your rent, though probably eye-wateringly high, will most likely include heating.

If you like the great outdoors then you would be as happy as in pig in the proverbial. Less so if you're a city and culture type. Even Zurich is a village compared to London or Paris.

In short, not necessarily as expensive as you think but that rate is a complete non-starter.

[Scrag Meister]

I went to Basel just over a year ago for 1 week to do a code review for a pharma and charged approx double my London Rate.

And yes it is ludicrously expensive.

1. Mediocre Thai for 1 takeaway £31
2. Indian takeaway, £25
3. Sandwich for lunch £7-8.
4. Pub meal and a pint £18.

I did have to pay flights and hotel out of my rate, but was still quids in.

[sunflower]

CHF 900 is a good rate. Some customers, especially those with long term gigs in finance, might pay CHF 800 per day. If you go direct to a client, the rate could be CHF 145 - 160.
Watch out for the canton tax wherever you are. If you are not in Switzerland for the whole UK tax year, make sure you check out tax equalisation with the UK. There is a thread on that.

[oilyrag]

Hi,
I have been offered a contract in Switzerland, 3 months of pretty niche IT development for a pharmaceutical client, and they want to pay me 500 eur / day. My own research suggests reasonable rates should be around 1000 CHF / day, meaning ~800 eur / day. What do you think? Anyone working there who could offer some insight?

I've been contracting in Switzerland since 2006, and there are a couple things to note. The rates have decreased since 2008 and there are plenty of IT people out of work here. Good developer rate would be CHF900 pd in Finance, CHF750/800 elsewhere, but agencies are advertising as low as CHF600 for Zurich finance gigs that were CHF950 in 2012. Large influx of Bobs to the banks added to mass redundancies and continuing offshoring programmes at the biggest employers are making life hard.

[Old Greg]

Scraps?

Mmmm - scraps and pea wet for free

I'd forgotten about scraps. It's a bit Dire Straits.

Wet for nothing and the scraps for free.

[DirtyDog]

That was me, admittedly Zurich Altstadt, touristy and dearer, £23 for fish and chips (not takeaway) cos I fancied and missed home and missed my mum and....

Wasn't even Cod or Plaice or even Haddock, guy told me it was Obscurefish or something to be fair. It was horrible. Chips where like oven chips done well rank and I'm not even lying. Peas not even mushy and the piece of resistance, no fecking gravy, no pea wet or anything moist whatsoever...

Scraps?

Mmmm - scraps and pea wet for free

[Old Greg]

That was me, admittedly Zurich Altstadt, touristy and dearer, £23 for fish and chips (not takeaway) cos I fancied and missed home and missed my mum and....

Wasn't even Cod or Plaice or even Haddock, guy told me it was Obscurefish or something to be fair. It was horrible. Chips where like oven chips done well rank and I'm not even lying. Peas not even mushy and the piece of resistance, no fecking gravy, no pea wet or anything moist whatsoever...

No wet??? Heathens.

[Old Greg]

So you are saying it's a complete **** up which ever way the OP intended to go?

whichever

[stek]

Aint it like £20 or so for something like fish and chips takeaway?

That was me, admittedly Zurich Altstadt, touristy and dearer, £23 for fish and chips (not takeaway) cos I fancied and missed home and missed my mum and....

Wasn't even Cod or Plaice or even Haddock, guy told me it was Obscurefish or something to be fair. It was horrible. Chips where like oven chips done well rank and I'm not even lying. Peas not even mushy and the piece of resistance, no fecking gravy, no pea wet or anything moist whatsoever...

[edison]

Aint it like £20 or so for something like fish and chips takeaway?

It's ridiculously expensive. I've been in Basel a few times recently for a client and one time bought a small takeaway lunch which would have probably been about £6-7 in somewhere like Pret in central London and it was the equivalent of £16. I'm not sure you could survive on less than 1000 Euros a day.

[aoxomoxoa]

Quite a lot of people stay in accomodation in France and cross the border every day for work. Accomodation can be a lot cheaper across the border.

When I was working at my pharma clientco in Basel, large numbers of their permies did just that.

And also, when arriving at BSL airport, it's worth knowing that it's significantly cheaper to rent a car from the French car rental booths at one end of the arrivals hall than from the Swiss equivalents at the other end. The only downsides being (a) a couple of miles further to get back into Switzerland, and (b) the possibility that the car woldn't have a Swiss motorway tax disc on the screen.

[CoolCat]

Quite a lot of people stay in accomodation in France and cross the border every day for work. Accomodation can be a lot cheaper across the border.