Reply to: Local candidates only and evidence of 'long' assignments on cv.

[Taita]

Agree there but some agents don't see it that way simply because they can't read.

Illiterate agents...... you have to be joking!!!!

[Earl Purple]

The long contract thing is just a crude way to ensure you have face fitting skills and the ability to stick on a good thing. I have two contacts that regularly manage to get sacked instead of renewed. Reason is they are fantastic techies who love pissing people off. I won't give them references anymore because I know they will get on at least one senior managers tits in 3 months. They are technologically sound and can do the work in their sleep.

My current client told me they would not expect me to stay very long as contractors don't stay. I pointed to my CV and said what like 2 years and 15 months then one that was 3 years... They are coming round now and starting to talk about next year....

Oh here we go the "face fit" tulipe, that used to be limited to permies and now us contractors have to face too.

I don't believe that they "love pissing people off". I believe they think they are being hired due to their technical expertise, and are being paid a rate to reflect it.

So they come along and give their technical expertise, which as you say, is sound. That means telling certain senior managers that things are currently wrong and should be done better.

Senior manager hates this outsider "threatening" his ego and wants them out, caring more about his ego than the business.

The contractors are probably aspies too.

They need to be found the right role. The reason contracts end early is often because they should never have been hired in the first place. Not because they are incompetent. Just the work isn't there for them. You wonder why therefore they were hired. Of course they took the role, either because they were lied to at the interview stage, or because they needed the money.

I could give a list of my roles and reasons they ended. Most of the time, there genuinely was nothing useful for me to do at the time of leaving, i.e. I had either done it or it was never there in the first place. Other times it is a political decision from upstairs, because I am an "overpaid" resource. (I have no idea if I am, because I don't know what the agency is charging them for my service. Perhaps if they wanted to pay less they wouldn't use agencies).

[Brussels Slumdog]

In those cases I am guessing they are looking for repeat business. Solved one problem well in a few weeks, got offered the next problem and so on...

My last 5 contracts have been with the same agency and I am currently on the bench. I am in regular contact with another 4 agencies and try my luck with the other agencies
I have a mental database of agencies who offer reasonable rates and which agencies are quoting Bob rates for the area
I have started to compile a list of Idiots that ask for references before the interview
Local Candidates in Belgium usually means French + Dutch + with the right accent. Long term in other EU countries means working over the 183 day limit which is suicidal

[bobspud]

Surely by reading someones CV you can judge whether its was a long term contract or short term contract
"Provided end user training" must indicate that the contract was only intended to be for a couple of weeks or months
"Provided 2nd line support" indicates that its normally long term
"Sent to Angola to sort out system" indicates that you are willing to travel.

In those cases I am guessing they are looking for repeat business. Solved one problem well in a few weeks, got offered the next problem and so on...

[BolshieBastard]

Surely by reading someones CV you can judge whether its was a long term contract or short term contract
"Provided end user training" must indicate that the contract was only intended to be for a couple of weeks or months
"Provided 2nd line support" indicates that its normally long term
"Sent to Angola to sort out system" indicates that you are willing to travel.

Jesus! You've some expectations in agents, havent you?

Half of them bombard you with emails for roles with skills that bear no resemblance to your cv and the other half are only interested in how far they can screw you down on rate!

[SueEllen]

Surely by reading someones CV you can judge whether its was a long term contract or short term contract
"Provided end user training" must indicate that the contract was only intended to be for a couple of weeks or months
"Provided 2nd line support" indicates that its normally long term
"Sent to Angola to sort out system" indicates that you are willing to travel.

Agree there but some agents don't see it that way simply because they can't read.

[Brussels Slumdog]

Read the CV to judge whether the contract was meant to be short term or long term

Surely by reading someones CV you can judge whether its was a long term contract or short term contract
"Provided end user training" must indicate that the contract was only intended to be for a couple of weeks or months
"Provided 2nd line support" indicates that its normally long term
"Sent to Angola to sort out system" indicates that you are willing to travel.

[bobspud]

It's the dead sea effect. The good ones often do not stay very long. In a few months they'll make all the positive contribution allowed by the mediocre managers and then move away for greener grass.

The inability to stick out a role till the client says thanks now you can leave is not the mark of a good contractor. Its unprofessional and no better than the sorts of guys that you see marked out on cowboy builders... You may not get to have your way and change the clients world, but then I doubt you were hired as interim CTO Most of our time is spent offering advice and taking the cash with the client choosing to do his own thing. Thats normal.

When I see a CV and the last 6 jobs dont go past three months there are only a few conclusions that can be drawn.

1) Only good for small jobs
2) Abilities dont match the CV
3) Good at annoying customers
4) Gets bored too easily
5) Cant play the long game well

Pick one or more of them they will all have some truth within them. Many clients that know that they are a PiA or have a project thats going to be a hard 12+ months (I can think of three DC migrations at the moment) they just dont want the clowns that answer pimps calls 2 months in or who turn out to be dead weights on team moral because there are guys having to redo their work for them.

Yes they are fully missing the chance to get some good people but then the flip side is too many contractors don't think strategically when they write their CV.

[Bluenose]

Wow £1k a day with a likelihood of 3+ year contract duration...££££££££

Looks good on paper, in reality taking a job like this is a major risk for a permie at a top 4 earning thick wedge (£250K+).

In this economic environment, anyone who lasts longer than 9 months in a front-office IT environment on that rate are rare. Surprise, the recruiter fluffs it up, reality is there is too much senior management movement (MD level) at the moment for any sort of stability in these high-level contract roles. As soon as a new MD moves in, you will be sweating.

Guess what, if you don't make it past 13 months you fall foul of the recruiters original requirements and you are on the scrap heap for the next role.

[xing]

It's the dead sea effect. The good ones often do not stay very long. In a few months they'll make all the positive contribution allowed by the mediocre managers and then move away for greener grass.

The long contract thing is just a crude way to ensure you have face fitting skills and the ability to stick on a good thing. I have two contacts that regularly manage to get sacked instead of renewed. Reason is they are fantastic techies who love pissing people off. I won't give them references anymore because I know they will get on at least one senior managers tits in 3 months. They are technologically sound and can do the work in their sleep.

My current client told me they would not expect me to stay very long as contractors don't stay. I pointed to my CV and said what like 2 years and 15 months then one that was 3 years... They are coming round now and starting to talk about next year....

[northernladuk]

Thats nuts though. Some contracts are only 3 months because there's only 3 months worth of work. Nothing to do with the quality of the contractor if thats all the work is there.

I disagree to some extent. Unfortunately, although he has changed his ways, NWP2C is one of the types that force this situation on him. Jumping ship on nearly every one of his first couple of years contracting push clients in to doing this so it isn't always the clients fault.

[psychocandy]

Having been both a contractor and a hiring manager, I know that this ridiculous looking requirement actually makes sense. When hiring contractors one nowadays finds such rotten eggs that it might be important to see if any client had retained the individual for a reasonable length of time. Say > 1 year. I would be on my guard if someone I am hiring has only ever done 3 month long stints. Just another sanity check.

Thats nuts though. Some contracts are only 3 months because there's only 3 months worth of work. Nothing to do with the quality of the contractor if thats all the work is there.

[DimPrawn]

I've come up against this a few times and it generally means the working environment + pay + project are so bad that most contractors want to jump ship as soon as something better (and more local) comes along and don't want to renew and hate every minute of being there.

It's a warning sign, move on, you'll be glad you did!

[norrahe]

FTFY

Not yet dearie!

Also the gig is technically a contract anyway, they don't do permie in the sense of UK style permiedom. B.V is on the back burner in case it all goes a bit MTT, ( which means I have to not dress to trendy and not speak down to people).

[Mephisto]

I'm coming up against this at the minute - my past few contracts have been very short DUE TO THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE CLIENT and I have had a few gaps of a month or two average between them all. Also whilst I'm technically NW based the area is so contract averse nowadays that I see myself as UK based and don't even flinch at staying away. In fact it's very normal!

Unfortunately these things appear to be yet another way of filtering CVs now that agents receive so many per role advertised.

As we now have to fight this tulipe along with buzzwords on the CV we are forced more and more to be less than generous with the truth:

- Has anyone stated they are based in xy area (close to client site) knowing full well they can jump on spareroom.com (if you hadn't done so already) and find many places at the drop of a hat?

- Has anyone stated their time with certain clients as longer than reality to a) reduce these gaps and b) not look useless?

Rough enough market out there without all this too