Reply to: Cutting contract short

[Scoi]

Update.

Boom

That is all

[ShandyDrinker]

I accept that a notice period could be construed as a good thing as both parties have a get out clause. However, if my business (or any business for that fact) is engaged to deliver X either within a specified time frame, budget or both then surely as the client you do not want the business walking away because of a notice period, you want them to stay until the job is complete rather than having to get another party in to do the work?

As Malvolio points out an asymmetric notice period is probably best (in the favour of your business) but is hardly equitable... As a business it's up to us to negotiate the best terms we can!

[malvolio]

You are not an employee, you are a business in which it is acceptable to have notice periods on contracts. Not quite so QED surely.

Yes, I know that... We're talking about not having one as a pointer away from emplyment.

The commercial ideal is assymetric notice periods, with you have a longish one and them a short one. But none on either side is much better, if you insist on running your life around IR35. I don't, so guess what my contract says.

[northernladuk]

Also don't quite get QDOS's reasoning. Employees have to have a notice period, that's in employment law. If you don't have one you aren't an employee. QED...

You are not an employee, you are a business in which it is acceptable to have notice periods on contracts. Not quite so QED surely.

[malvolio]

Have heard if notice period is not specified then how often you get paid is the notice period, so monthly 1 months notice.

Nope, not even close. If it's not specified then there isn't one, you stay till the job is done or you negotiate an exit or (shock gasp) you send in a substitute.

Try and be reasonable but in the end suit yourself, as client would do same.

Nothing to do with being reasonable, all to do with being professional and coming to a mutually satisfactory result. And client's do care, unless you're some minor nothing at the bottom of the food chain; at the very least they get to waste two week's work finding a replacement.

Also don't quite get QDOS's reasoning. Employees have to have a notice period, that's in employment law. If you don't have one you aren't an employee. QED...

[ShandyDrinker]

Mal is the notice period expert but business wise there is nothing wrong with a notice period. It isn't bad business to write a notice period in, it can help should your supplier not be performing or your business model changes. There are situations where you may need to get out. My last client invoked notice period on a global outsourcer as they were not performing so you can't say no notice period=good business. Infact you could argue tying yourself in to a supplier you can not get rid of except through exceptional circumstances could be seen as bad for a business.

Can't argue with the points you make. Certainly when I've worked for software houses in the past the only termination clauses have been on the basis of non performance/delivery (aside from the usual stuff about takeover, going bust etc) rather than one side or the other being able to give notice. In many ways I think this is as it should be as if you're a business having to resource projects you don't want the client being able to pull the plug unless you are not delivering as requested of course.

I'd definitely agree that notice periods aren't necessarily a bad thing. In the context of my initial response I was just surprised QDOS marked it as a negative with respect to IR35!

[escapeUK]

If i was certain of the gig i would, or maybe it would spur me on to be truly awesome next week as i knew it was all or nothing. Why a company i worked for for 5 years want to interview me is a bit strange but better than saying no straight off.

A lot of people can leave / join in 2 years never mind 5.

[Scoi]

If i was certain of the gig i would, or maybe it would spur me on to be truly awesome next week as i knew it was all or nothing. Why a company i worked for for 5 years want to interview me is a bit strange but better than saying no straight off.

[northernladuk]

I invoice weekly so no bother there. My hope is: interview Wednesday. Get the nod by the end of the week. Tell current boss by COB Friday. 2 week handover if needed.

I'm on a contract for multiple small projects so I can make sure i'm finished everything by the time i'm off. I think most people know i'm on the lookout, new permie's starting by the end of the year and i'm heading out for a call every day.

Start your handover now?

[Scoi]

Hopefully current client is as understanding as yours. I don't see why they wouldn't be, i'm not a key player on any projects at the moment but i am planned to be so hopefully can get this sorted before the next project kicks off. Would require a new contract for a new project anyway.

I'm not leaving because i don't like it but 15 minute drive each way and living at home is worth a lot.

[portseven]

In a similar situation here

Current contract ends 31/12/12, will be off from 16/12/12 due to client stating no contractors working over xmas

Had a chat with on-site co-ordinator here, saying a renewal is unlikley (been here 3.5yrs now and last renewal was a work of art to get through) and so if i get something else happy for me to leave early. This week I got offered a new contract, new client, better money, interesting stuff, and so invoked said notice period, no bridges burnt, old client would have me back anytime.

Currently in discussions with both sides as new one wants me asap, and old one wants full handover. One option is do a day a week at new one starting next week.

[northernladuk]

My opinion is that if you have a contract with no notice on either side then surely this would be a pointer to a proper business relationship as you don't want either side to be able to walk away from the contract unless there is negligence or one of the parties is either taken over or goes bust?!

Mal is the notice period expert but business wise there is nothing wrong with a notice period. It isn't bad business to write a notice period in, it can help should your supplier not be performing or your business model changes. There are situations where you may need to get out. My last client invoked notice period on a global outsourcer as they were not performing so you can't say no notice period=good business. Infact you could argue tying yourself in to a supplier you can not get rid of except through exceptional circumstances could be seen as bad for a business.

[Scoi]

I invoice weekly so no bother there. My hope is: interview Wednesday. Get the nod by the end of the week. Tell current boss by COB Friday. 2 week handover if needed.

I'm on a contract for multiple small projects so I can make sure i'm finished everything by the time i'm off. I think most people know i'm on the lookout, new permie's starting by the end of the year and i'm heading out for a call every day.

[ShandyDrinker]

Yeah I can imagine not having notice would be ok for IR35, just thought documenting something would have been more clear from a legal perspective but guess that is just being a pedant...

Was really surprised with a previous contract review (by QDOS) which had no notice period (on either side) who said it was actually bad from an IR35 perspective whereas my accountants thought it was absolutely fine... just shows what a grey area this is.

My opinion is that if you have a contract with no notice on either side then surely this would be a pointer to a proper business relationship as you don't want either side to be able to walk away from the contract unless there is negligence or one of the parties is either taken over or goes bust?!

[brendan_uk]

Have heard if notice period is not specified then how often you get paid is the notice period, so monthly 1 months notice.
Try and be reasonable but in the end suit yourself, as client would do same.