Reply to: Ltd Company Details Doc

[NickNick]

... I always believed before that Sanderson where 'one of the good guys'.

And that is why you fail. ;o) I will never pass up an opportunity to slate them.

[Peoplesoft bloke]

So why then is every agency in the country going through hoops to get compliant with the new regulations. It's not for fun, I would guess. Perhaps it's becuase they, as the primary supplier of the worker, are best placed to run the checks befor the worker arrives, possibly illegally, at the client's premises?

My agency isn't asking for this nonsense, it's only the stupid ones who don't know what they are doing. It is not a legal requirement.

[bassy]

hmm I have just had the same request for these details after a contract extension with Sanderson (its about the 4th extension now as I only sign extensions for one month at a time for this). However I dont have copies of the so-called form3 and form4. They already have all the business and liability information and there is no way I am sending utility bills (dont actually receive paper ones - and this is way too personal an item) or a passport (I dont have one), nor will I send 2 references (I dont want another agency to be in competition with me if I try to win further work from a previous client). I have also opted out of agency regs (and long before I met the client as I send a standard letter to all agencies when they say they are putting our cv forward for a role)

Funny thing is that their letter says that without these documents they will not pay invoices, however, there is nothing in the contract to state that these must be sent (only has listed the old vat, liability etc docs). Further I also have security clearance (from other contracts) and this was checked by the client before starting. Any failure to pay my companies' invoices will be met by the standard interest invoice etc whilst as I am only extending a month at a time, withdrawal of company services with information to the client on why.

tbh I dont really want to do the extension as I am just about breaking even on it and am only doing so to help the client out whilst they advertise for a permie. The fact that I am now the only person who knows how the system works and other reasons puts me in quite a good position.

But requests for this sort of information are getting a little too excessive (utility bills !) and I always believed before that Sanderson where 'one of the good guys'. This sort of thing is really beginning to miff me.

[NotAllThere]

Thanks NotAllThere, that kind of explains it but they know I've a UK based company

Maybe if your UK based company has an offshore bank account then they'd be in the same boat?

I find the whole thing confused as well. Some agencies/clients are quite happy to deal with my Swiss company for UK contracts, others aren't.

[Badger]

Thanks NotAllThere, that kind of explains it but they know I've a UK based company

[NotAllThere]

If you were trading in the UK through a company registered in Switzerland, and you neglected to pay the corp tax from the profits generated in the UK, then HMRC might try to get that unpaid tax from the agency.

[Badger]

Update, sent a letter which included:

"With reference to your request for copies of passport and proof of residence it is not MyCO's policy to give out this information on any MyCo employee due to the Data Protection Act (1998), potential for identity theft and the risk of this data not being stored securely at third parties. MyCo has confirmed the identity of all it's employees and will indemnify the agency if proven incorrect."

No further requests for id

And have now received a contract but they will not send the hard copy until I sign the Offshore parts of the Ltd Company Details form:

>No payments received from this contract are being transferred off shore. Off >Shore includes, but is not limited to, Jersey, Guernsey, and Isle of Man, >Gibraltar, Cyprus, Switzerland
>
>Confirm by signing ________________________
>Confirm by printing name ___________________

Why would they insist on this, what's it got to do with them where I potentially transfer MyCo's money to??

[Moscow Mule]

So why then is every agency in the country going through hoops to get compliant with the new regulations. It's not for fun, I would guess. Perhaps it's becuase they, as the primary supplier of the worker, are best placed to run the checks befor the worker arrives, possibly illegally, at the client's premises?

Are you sure it's every agency?

Perhaps it's because they haven't understood the subtle difference between a temp and a b2b consultancy agreement.

I'm sure you'd be the first to agree that agencies aren't the best at understanding regulations...

[malvolio]

As I understand it, all of the legislation (Immigration, Asylum and Nationality Act 2006) refers to Employment, not placing and is therefore not relevant.

The KYC part of the money laundering regulations don't apply to Employment Agencies, even if they did what they are asking you to supply (copy of passport etc) doesn't cover the rules anyway.

So why then is every agency in the country going through hoops to get compliant with the new regulations. It's not for fun, I would guess. Perhaps it's becuase they, as the primary supplier of the worker, are best placed to run the checks befor the worker arrives, possibly illegally, at the client's premises?

[Moscow Mule]

Makes perfect sense. It's nothing to do with your work or how your contract is arranged with the end client, it's about you personally.

The agency find themselves in the position where they have to be able to guarantee to HMG that the workers they are placing are allowed to work in the UK - which sort of requires they have proof of who you are - and that you are not breaching the latest flavour of the money laundering regulations (and a few peripheral side effects like checking you aren't obviously operating a VAT carousel fraud).

And it has no impact on IR35 or global warming, before you ask

As I understand it, all of the legislation (Immigration, Asylum and Nationality Act 2006) refers to Employment, not placing and is therefore not relevant.

The KYC part of the money laundering regulations don't apply to Employment Agencies, even if they did what they are asking you to supply (copy of passport etc) doesn't cover the rules anyway.

[malvolio]

Makes perfect sense. It's nothing to do with your work or how your contract is arranged with the end client, it's about you personally.

The agency find themselves in the position where they have to be able to guarantee to HMG that the workers they are placing are allowed to work in the UK - which sort of requires they have proof of who you are - and that you are not breaching the latest flavour of the money laundering regulations (and a few peripheral side effects like checking you aren't obviously operating a VAT carousel fraud).

And it has no impact on IR35 or global warming, before you ask

[Badger]

Those are my thoughts aswell MM. If My Co employs 5 consultants with the same skillset would I have to supply passport/address details for all of them?! Makes no sense to me

[Moscow Mule]

...

However agencies now have a legal requirement or two to satisfy that require proof of ID and residency, it ain't going to go away so we wlill all ahve to cope with it. Blame the EU and this pointless petifogging government.
...

I'm not a temp, the agency is not employing me.

AIUI, there is no legal requirement for the agency to gather this info in a b2b relationship.

[malvolio]

As always a constructive helpful post. Perhap I should offer buy now pay 2009 terms.

Whatever. I've been running on 30-60 day payment terms for most of the last 15 years, and I ain't gone bankrupt yet. YMMV of course.

As for the Identity thing, a copy of the back page of your passport taken by YourCo and certified as perfectly valid is sufficient proof of identity. Otherwise you have to present the passport in person to whoever wants the proof, and they may then take a copy for their own records in your presence. Any other variation is not actually a valid proof.

However agencies now have a legal requirement or two to satisfy that require proof of ID and residency, it ain't going to go away so we wlill all ahve to cope with it. Blame the EU and this pointless petifogging government.

By all means get precious about the data but (a) your ID is in the public domain as a company director anyway and (b) you most likely won't get the gig.

[Badger]

Funniest thing I've read this week (OK, there's plenty of time to go yet...)

If you want paying one day after your invoice goes in, or you can't manage your cashflow well enough to cope with a 30 day turnaround, I suggest you get a permie role. Otherwise, 30-90 day payment terms are a fact of business life, learn to live with it

As always a constructive helpful post. Perhap I should offer buy now pay 2009 terms.