Reply to: Immediate termination of contract

[rocktronAMP]

This happened to me twice now and I'm beginning to wonder if contractors should have some sort of employment protection. Without wanting to go into the details my work was of a good standard (dare I say excellent) and I had been with the organisations for a few weeks (one was a couple of months). However, my immediate line manager decided he didn't want to work with me any more and that was it. I would consider both individuals quite immature (dare I say bullies) and because they could terminate me immediately they enjoyed being able to do that, something they couldn't do to a perm staff member.

Both of these contracts were in the public sector so I'm wondering if this is something peculiar to the public sector. As I already mentioned this has happened twice now and it's making me reluctant to consider public sector contracts given how poorly they treat contractors (not to mention the whole IR35 business).

This sounds like a several things:

1) Another tyrannical project manager situation (see that other forum thread) and you have been unlucky to with him or her for the second time running.

2) The pace of public sector is very drawn out and forcing any change like agile, digital and infrastructure transformation requires a certain authority and political power. Contractors are not consultants sadly and I'd say 98% we don't have the power, the other side has the power. We can only vote with our two feet.

3) Yet another example of BLAME CULTURE and unfortunately you are the contractor with the target on your back marked as Dispensible for Whatever, Whenever and Wherever. If you want guarantees then switch to permanent employment and even then probation periods can drag on for up to 2 years legally.

4) The project manager personally knows some other contractor that will soon fill your position. In other words, your productivity is not good, your communication and your relationship is not good; and the PM is pining for old contractor (the old mate), who will soon return that your position when they finished their current gig (I've seen that happen very recently to another guy).

5) The company want to outsource your position in a few months and this just an excuse to get terminate the contract and save budget

Try not to take it to heart, absorb the criticism, reflect, learn, reform and move to the next contract gig. Personally I have recently seen (1) and (3) and it is really annoying. I think this is generally the state of the art in post Brexit Britain, the uncertainty, the politics and increase of blame culture. Just make sure that you, fix you.

[northernladyuk]

If you want employment protection, go permanent. After 2 years, you get limited protection.

The rule is that if there is an incident between contractor and permanent, and the contractor is blameless, then the contractor always gets the push. Seen it a few times.

There are 2 explanations as to why it has happened twice: -
1. The statistics of random events - there are usually far less random than people realize.
2. You need to modify your behavior.

It depends. I've been in this situation twice.

First time, the permie senior manager 'had form', and ended up on a disciplinary.

Second time, I was asked to modify my approach and after four weeks, it was agreed that I had, but that it wasn't working out ,so they would would seek to move me from that client to another client, which I declined, so we didn't renew my contract. Now looking to sell services again to this second client.

[vadhert]

I'd take a guess from the OP's name instead of MTFU then need to WTFU. Maybe WTFH can mediate for us.

Hmm...

On reflection OP needs to MTFU/WTFU and STFU at next gig.

HTH

[BR14]

Is it twice out of two contracts or twice out of many contracts? It's perfectly possible to meet two such bellends in this industry.

just go anywhere arthurs androids are <under whatever new name they have>

[pauldee]

Is it twice out of two contracts or twice out of many contracts? It's perfectly possible to meet two such bellends in this industry.

[psychocandy]

Hmmm. There are some real bellends out there who would do this sort of thing. I've met one once in a contract and it was just unbelievable...

But twice. Could be bad luck but who knows.

OP - Are you sure you're not winding people up? As I always say, getting on with people, especially the permies is more often than not more important than anything else.

[washed up contractor]

Crap! Seems like I missed the fun! Reading comments from the OP (my work was excellent blah, blah, blah) gives all the clues you need to understand why they were jettisoned not once, but twice. And it's going to be a third time if he \ she doesnt modify their behaviour.

I also get the impression the OP has a disdain for younger bosses which probably comes across in their attitude at work.

[oscarose]

go back to permie land.

qh

+1 (100%)

[quackhandle]

OP needs to MTFU, dust him/herself off, find a new gig and keep quiet.

Or better still, go back to permie land.

qh

[northernladuk]

OP needs to MTFU, dust him/herself off, find a new gig and keep quiet.

I'd take a guess from the OP's name instead of MTFU then need to WTFU. Maybe WTFH can mediate for us.

[vadhert]

OP needs to MTFU, dust him/herself off, find a new gig and keep quiet.

[SueEllen]

I was thinking more morally than legally. I certainly wouldn't want to try and argue it in court although it would be interesting if someone did.

I often wonder what tax Uber/Hermes contractors/employees pay, and if they would be happy to suddenly start paying full PAYE if they are officially recognised as employees.

There have been tribunal cases that have proved some self-employed people for companies like that are workers so entitled to benefits like statutory sick pay.

[pauldee]

Logically, possibly. But logic doesn't come into it - taxation and employment status do not go hand in hand, so you could win one tribunal but lose the other.

I was thinking more morally than legally. I certainly wouldn't want to try and argue it in court although it would be interesting if someone did.

I often wonder what tax Uber/Hermes contractors/employees pay, and if they would be happy to suddenly start paying full PAYE if they are officially recognised as employees.

[TheFaQQer]

Just thought I'd throw this one in. More of a thought experiment than my genuine opinion:

If you're inside IR35 and considered an employee for tax purposes, should you then logically be entitled to the benefits that come with being classed as an employee as well as the downsides, and therefore have the same rights as an employee?

Logically, possibly. But logic doesn't come into it - taxation and employment status do not go hand in hand, so you could win one tribunal but lose the other.

[pauldee]

Just thought I'd throw this one in. More of a thought experiment than my genuine opinion:

If you're inside IR35 and considered an employee for tax purposes, should you then logically be entitled to the benefits that come with being classed as an employee as well as the downsides, and therefore have the same rights as an employee?