Reply to: Newbie contractor + direct contract for swiss company = confusion

[missinggreenfields]

It would indeed be better to have the contract under Swiss law in case it all goes pear shaped. I suggest you draft the contract, say it's under Swiss law, and get a Swiss lawyer to give it the once over (~£300 - I can give a name if you need it). Swiss law isn't so massively different from UK law for it to matter too much.

If that affects the ability to claim under an insurance policy if the client goes bust, then it makes a huge difference - particularly with a startup.

[sal]

Sounds fishy if they don't care about such detail. Maybe the Swiss client wont be around long enough to pay you for your work? Litigation on an English Law contract has to be done in an English court, and then enforcing any such County Court Judgement obtained in an English court against a Swiss creditor can be extremely difficult (The Lugano Convention applies).

Tread carefully.

always the glass half-empty eh..

OP didn't say they "don't care" but that they agreed. If it's a niche skill and they are happy with someone working remotely from the UK, it's only natural they are going to agree on this demand as well.

@OP, just get the to agree on a good payment schedule, weekly preferably and the wort that can happen is for you to lose 1-2 weeks of invoicing, while working on something you clearly consider exciting. Which beats losing 1-2 weeks of invoicing sitting on the bench...

Even better ask your friend who already work for them if they pay on time, if they do and the contract is from IPSE and you work from UK, it's happy days

[NotAllThere]

Sounds fishy if they don't care about such detail. Maybe the Swiss client wont be around long enough to pay you for your work? Litigation on an English Law contract has to be done in an English court, and then enforcing any such County Court Judgement obtained in an English court against a Swiss creditor can be extremely difficult (The Lugano Convention applies).

Tread carefully.

It would indeed be better to have the contract under Swiss law in case it all goes pear shaped. I suggest you draft the contract, say it's under Swiss law, and get a Swiss lawyer to give it the once over (~£300 - I can give a name if you need it). Swiss law isn't so massively different from UK law for it to matter too much.

[chopper]

I thought I'd post what I'd found out in case it helps anyone else.
I phoned the IPSE legal helpline and they told me that as long as the Swiss company agrees that the contract is subject to English law, then it's OK to use the template contracts on the IPSE site.
They've agreed that it is, so I'm working through sorting out the contract based on the IPSE template.
Thanks to all for the advice.

Sounds fishy if they don't care about such detail. Maybe the Swiss client wont be around long enough to pay you for your work? Litigation on an English Law contract has to be done in an English court, and then enforcing any such County Court Judgement obtained in an English court against a Swiss creditor can be extremely difficult (The Lugano Convention applies).

Tread carefully.

[eoz783399]

I thought I'd post what I'd found out in case it helps anyone else.
I phoned the IPSE legal helpline and they told me that as long as the Swiss company agrees that the contract is subject to English law, then it's OK to use the template contracts on the IPSE site.
They've agreed that it is, so I'm working through sorting out the contract based on the IPSE template.
Thanks to all for the advice.

[Eirikur]

If it is a start up I wouldn't do it. You have to have iron cast guarantees you will be paid and they have enough cash to do so. Working with a company that is in another jurisdiction is not going to make it easier for you to get your slice of the money when they call in the administrators.

[eoz783399]

Ooh, take care when working in Switzerland, I've already told the story of when I nearly got thrown out of Switzerland and was banned from working there for 3 months.

Take a look at these before you sign anything:
http://forums.contractoruk.com/busin...ve-beware.html

http://forums.contractoruk.com/busin...itzerland.html

I won't be living or working in Switzerland - just occasionally going over for meetings so I don't think these problems will effect me hopefully.

[northernladuk]

Ooh, take care when working in Switzerland, I've already told the story of when I nearly got thrown out of Switzerland and was banned from working there for 3 months.

Is that the one with the goatherd, alphorn and lots of yoddeling? Or was that the time before.

Good to see they've still got standards over there

[cojak]

Ooh, take care when working in Switzerland, I've already told the story of when I nearly got thrown out of Switzerland and was banned from working there for 3 months.

Take a look at these before you sign anything:
http://forums.contractoruk.com/busin...ve-beware.html

http://forums.contractoruk.com/busin...itzerland.html

[eoz783399]

Thanks to all for the advice - I've just joined IPSE plus and am going to get stuck into their templates.

[northernladuk]

Check the business interruption with IPSE+ membership to see they cover anything in case you don't get paid and fill you boots then.

[NotAllThere]

Working in the UK for a Swiss company, you just bill without VAT. It seems to be it would be difficult to be inside IR35 for this one. For a start, the Swiss company would tell HMRC to get knotted if they started demanding information about working practices.

I recommend quoting a price in CHF.

[eoz783399]

I've spoken to my accountant and they've explained that I won't be able to charge VAT. I'll be working in the UK so won't need to pay Swiss tax or anything.

I know it's a risk, but the role is so perfect that I'm willing to take a risk for a couple of months. The people involved are well known in my industry which offers some comfort.

[eoz783399]

I'm so glad you've said it'd be crazy - I thought I was just being rubbish by not wanting to do it! I was already looking at IPSE - my only concern is that the Swiss part might cause extra problems.

[northernladuk]

Well you can go to IPSE or QDOS and use their templates so getting a contract isn't a problem.

Working for a Swiss company could be though and it being a start up could be even tougher. You've not put enough detail in but IR35 won't be an issue

QDOS, Abbey Tax, B&C etc should be able to do a contract check for you as well.

You do need to check the payment terms though. Being a start up there is always the risk they go belly up and and you don't get paid. We've had plenty of posts where contractors were offered share options or something like that and I believe in most of them it went tits up leaving the contractor out of pocket. Certainly not something I'd be bothering with.

Do you have an accountant and have you discussed the tax situations with them?

NAT, one of our Mods works over there so he might have some good advice for you.

Some threads to read here..

http://forums.contractoruk.com/umbre...itzerland.html
http://forums.contractoruk.com/busin...ny-zurich.html
http://forums.contractoruk.com/busin...ve-beware.html

http://www.contractoruk.com/overseas...money_tax.html


Sounds like you've bitten off quite a bit here and with such a short timescale I'd keep looking for gigs in the meantime if I were you.