Reply to: Remainers pushing for second referendum think Brexiteers are 'thick' and 'prejudiced

[vetran]

Thankfully I've only had one conversation IRL with a Brexiteer about Brexit. He seemed very angry about gay marriage, Turkey joining the EU and immigrants pricing his half Spanish kids out of the housing market. This was why he voted Brexiteer.

listening to your stepfather when he is pissed is not talking to a Brexiter.

[minestrone]

You don't get a vote in accepting them, your duly elected representatives in Parliament do. That's democracy for you.

HTH.

You may be struggling with understanding that my MP, like the vast majority, will vote to reject the terms.

I don't see any clear route beyond that where this deal will be accepted or that leaving in March can be stopped.

Joyous.

[Whorty]

That's because you're looking in the wrong place. Try looking in the Conservative Party manifesto.

Conservative manifesto summary: Key points at-a-glance - BBC News

Don't confuse them with reality and fact. Brexiters think the whole process is based on that one piece of paper only. FFS, they do constantly live up to the idea that they're all

[meridian]

"Agree terms of future partnership with EU alongside withdrawal, both within the two years allowed under Article 50 "

Fantastic, they agreed them, they are tulipe, we're not accepting them.

Bring on the cliff edge.

You don't get a vote in accepting them, your duly elected representatives in Parliament do. That's democracy for you.

HTH.

[sasguru]

"Agree terms of future partnership with EU alongside withdrawal, both within the two years allowed under Article 50 "

Fantastic, they agreed them, they are tulipe, we're not accepting them.

Bring on the cliff edge.

The terms of the future partnership have not been agreed.
But I guess it's not the first time a Brexiter has been ignorant/misinformed.

[minestrone]

That's because you're looking in the wrong place. Try looking in the Conservative Party manifesto.

Conservative manifesto summary: Key points at-a-glance - BBC News

"Agree terms of future partnership with EU alongside withdrawal, both within the two years allowed under Article 50 "

Fantastic, they agreed them, they are tulipe, we're not accepting them.

Bring on the cliff edge.

[meridian]

And can article 50 actually be rescinded? without penalty? after wasting two years of 28 country's time and effort?
Really?

Yes, possibly. We'll know this week.

[meridian]

That's odd, can't quite remember that being an option...

That's because you're looking in the wrong place. Try looking in the Conservative Party manifesto.

Conservative manifesto summary: Key points at-a-glance - BBC News

Exit the European single market and customs union but seek a "deep and special partnership" including comprehensive free trade and customs agreement
Vote in both Houses of Parliament on "final agreement" for Brexit
Assess whether to continue with specific European programmes and it "will be reasonable that we make a contribution" to the ones which continue
Agree terms of future partnership with EU alongside withdrawal, both within the two years allowed under Article 50

[BR14]

That's odd, can't quite remember that being an option...

And can article 50 actually be rescinded? without penalty? after wasting two years of 28 country's time and effort?
Really?

[minestrone]

It did indeed, but not by which mechanism. Both Norway and Canada were often put up as examples by leave as deals we would look to base our deal on. There was never a mention on no deal; this is a more recent idea put forward by JRM and his cronies at ERG.

People, therefore, never voted for no deal. They voted for this government to negotiate a deal. They have now done this. If the people do t like this deal they should have a choice to reject it, and thus also reject brexit.

You can't have it all ways dear boy. You wanted a brexit deal, you have a brexit deal. Suck it up, or vote to remain in the EU (assuming MPs reject the deal first on your behalf)

That's odd, can't quite remember that being an option...

[meridian]

We all have Gina Millar to thank for the current mess. She got parliament the vote on the deal. Before Gina Millar's intervention Teresa May intended to unilaterally agree to the deal without a parliamentary vote.

??

How is the person that won a court case that confirms Parliamentary sovereignty the cause?

Wasn’t Parliamentary sovereignty the thing that you were voting for? Not her fault that most of the MPs couldn’t find their arses with a map and a torch.

[Yorkie62]

Every EU leader including the EU negotiators have said:



What part of that do Leavers not understand? We've got Fallon and now Johnson saying May should go back, are they just thick or deluded?

No just part of normal negotiations. If TM's deal cannot get through parliament then we have two options. We try to re-engage with the EU in further negotiations, and if the EU doesn't want to engage further then both parties, as they would in any negotiations, must go their separate ways with no deal.

Surely you have been through this sort of process when negotiating contract terms. If you can't agree terms you walk away.

[darmstadt]

Every EU leader including the EU negotiators have said:

EU leaders have dismissed talk of renegotiating the draft Brexit deal and warned the UK's political situation could make a "no-deal" more likely.

What part of that do Leavers not understand? We've got Fallon and now Johnson saying May should go back, are they just thick or deluded?

[Yorkie62]

It did indeed, but not by which mechanism. Both Norway and Canada were often put up as examples by leave as deals we would look to base our deal on. There was never a mention on no deal; this is a more recent idea put forward by JRM and his cronies at ERG.

People, therefore, never voted for no deal. They voted for this government to negotiate a deal. They have now done this. If the people do t like this deal they should have a choice to reject it, and thus also reject brexit.

You can't have it all ways dear boy. You wanted a brexit deal, you have a brexit deal. Suck it up, or vote to remain in the EU (assuming MPs reject the deal first on your behalf)

Your logic is a little flawed. Just because you reject what is on offer does not mean that you have to accept anything, including the status quo. You could go back and say we reject your offer now lets discuss why I reject your offer. The way negotiations normally work if both parties cant agree then you agree to go your separate ways without agreeing to a deal. Agreeing to remain in the EU is still agreeing to a deal. It just so happens that it is the deal that was on the table before the UK held a referendum and its people voted to leave. However, I seriously doubt that the EU will let the UK rescind A50 within some further concessions, and until we know the new terms of our remaining in the EU it cannot be voted on, because as you keep reminding us we simply do not know what we would be voting for. Unless of course you would like to enlighten us all and spell out what the EU terms would be for the UK to rescind A50.

We all have Gina Millar to thank for the current mess. She got parliament the vote on the deal. Before Gina Millar's intervention Teresa May intended to unilaterally agree to the deal without a parliamentary vote.

[darmstadt]

There is one problem with the Norway deal as this basically EFTA and EEA of which other countries are also members. If the UK wanted to go in that direction then they're then going to have to get acceptance from Norway, Lichtenstein, Iceland and Switzerland and there are other, new, problems there...