Reply to: Contractor working 2 jobs at the same time

[diesel]

I have multiple contracts at any one time. Right now, I have two massive clients (one banking, one in oil) who between them employ over 240,000 employees worldwide. Both would like me to work as full time as possible. Both understand I have other clients. The thing is, I'm not bad at what I do, and can sometimes do a piece of analysis and work in 2 hours which would ordinarily take four days to achieve. So I bill based partly on time worked and partly on output/time the client has saved.

So sometimes I do bill full days for both clients, even though I might only have worked for seven hours in a day. I look at what I have honestly achieved that day and determine whether I am comfortable billing a full or half day for each client. Some days, I don't bill at all, others I bill lots. Both my clients are very happy with the output.

The only challenge is limiting the amount of meetings I'm asked to attend.

I call my approach: business. I'd personally keep your nose out of things that don't concern you. Don't mean to be harsh, but it's quite possible that this chap is doing really well and people are happy with him.

I am working 2 clients right now...spend a few days at one clients office, then a day at another..both want me full time, but I am delivering for both, I only bill for hours worked on their jobs.
I get annoyed when others at client A office keep asking me "are u working somewhere else?" ....tell them nothing to do with them.

[DirtyDog]

A lot of posts are assuming that the OP's friend has approached both clients with a contract that allows this flexibility and is managed and measured in an agreed way which is fine.

I didn't assume it was his friend at all:

While my mate has recently got a new contract we realised that the same contractor is working two contracts at the same time

I took it that OP is working for one client with Contractor X, mate is working for another client with Contractor X. They are both working with X for different clients, therefore X must have more than one client.

That being the case, neither the OP nor his mate know the contractual situation, so nor will we.

[northernladuk]

A lot of posts are assuming that the OP's friend has approached both clients with a contract that allows this flexibility and is managed and measured in an agreed way which is fine.

I would take a guess that if he just 'realised' it there is a high risk that the contracts haven't been approached as I mentioned and he is in a situation where he is just blatantly abusing the clients by billing them for time he just isn't doing.

I wonder what would happen in his situation if he went to each of his client and explained he has multiple revenue streams and time would be allocated in the best way between them. I am guessing one or neither would be overly happy.

We just need more details.

[Brussels Slumdog]

This is how offshoring works -multiple clients

This is how offshoring works . I ask for a quote and they quote me 80hrs. I have no idea whether it is 80 hours this week or over the next 2 months as they always seem to come back with excuses why they have not delivered. One reason is that they have multiple clients and my client is less important. What does this contractor do when both clients have a deadline for the same day?

[mudskipper]

If he is genuinely billing two clients for 5 days a week each, and only putting in 40 hours work, then he is taking the piss.

How do you know his contractual arrangements? How do you know he's not working evenings and weekends to fulfill both roles?

In any case, it's up to the client(s) to pull him up.

[SueEllen]

Morally I think it’s wrong as he is trying to offload his work onto his co-workers and he is cashing in double day rate with doing the bare minimum?

There is no moral about it.

First how do you know his individual contract terms? Different contractors for the same client, and even employees in the same company can have different contracts due to what they negotiate. While you should do this anyway - if you are likely to have more than one contract at a time then you negotiate your contract terms to take this into account.

Secondly if he's trying to offload work on to you then first politely refuse to do it. If he's stupid enough to try it again then make sure the client hears both you and other people refusing to do it with good explanations why. Part of the rise of Agile methodologies is to keep an eye on people's work effort.

[DirtyDog]

really so you think its ok that some one does the bare minimum and cashes in double?

If the contractor meets the client requirements and expectations, then yes.

Yes and I am a proper contractor. I deliver on time and all my clients are happy with my work for years. And that is what a proper contrcator should be.

From your original post it's not quite clear - which of the two clients are unhappy with the work? What steps have the clients taken to discuss their dissatisfaction with the supplier?

But for you a proper contractor just seems to be take the money and run?

No - you do what you are contracted to do. If the client is dissatisfied then you work to remedy their dissatisfaction.

I'm interested in making sure my clients are satisfied with my performance, not whether two wannabes can't get their heads round the ability to deliver for multiple clients concurrently.

[Boney M]

I have multiple contracts at any one time. Right now, I have two massive clients (one banking, one in oil) who between them employ over 240,000 employees worldwide. Both would like me to work as full time as possible. Both understand I have other clients. The thing is, I'm not bad at what I do, and can sometimes do a piece of analysis and work in 2 hours which would ordinarily take four days to achieve. So I bill based partly on time worked and partly on output/time the client has saved.

So sometimes I do bill full days for both clients, even though I might only have worked for seven hours in a day. I look at what I have honestly achieved that day and determine whether I am comfortable billing a full or half day for each client. Some days, I don't bill at all, others I bill lots. Both my clients are very happy with the output.

The only challenge is limiting the amount of meetings I'm asked to attend.

I call my approach: business. I'd personally keep your nose out of things that don't concern you. Don't mean to be harsh, but it's quite possible that this chap is doing really well and people are happy with him.

WHS \thread

[Sausage Surprise]

really so you think its ok that some one does the bare minimum and cashes in double?

Yes and I am a proper contractor. I deliver on time and all my clients are happy with my work for years. And that is what a proper contrcator should be.

But for you a proper contractor just seems to be take the money and run?

No. Proper contracting for me means I'm a business. I may provide my services to one client for a full week but that doesn't stop me advertising my services elsewhere. For example I also repair PCs as well being a test manager. So, multiple income streams through my ltd means I'm a business. That's what contracting is about for me.

[malvolio]

And legal action if they feel particularly aggrieved at his actions. If he is invoicing per day and not clearly not working the day he is committing fraud and theft, neither of which a client will take lying down. I would like to see him getting further work with fraud against clients on his records.... Stupid move.

You maybe need to research the meaning of "Professional Working Day". If I do any work for a client in any 24 hour period, I am entitled to charge them the agreed PWD rate. The trick is to keep the six hour days more numerous than the 20 hour ones.

[jamesbrown]

As others have said, it's for the clients to decide whether the contracts are being delivered. It's not uncommon to have two or more concurrent contracts, especially if one or more of them are FFP.

[northernladuk]

He has one job - working for his Ltd / umbrella. He has multiple clients, who all seem to be happy with his work - if they aren't then the client should be pursuing this, with a view to possible termination.

And legal action if they feel particularly aggrieved at his actions. If he is invoicing per day and not clearly not working the day he is committing fraud and theft, neither of which a client will take lying down. I would like to see him getting further work with fraud against clients on his records.... Stupid move.

[northernladuk]

I think this is a good helper with IR35 status and it is my duty to my shareholders to maximise profit if I can.

IR35 is on a contract by contract basis. One could be in, one could be out etc. It is good for the Business Entity Tests which are a first indicator as to whether or not HMRC come looking for you though.

[northernladuk]

It's called "Business". As long as he's delivering that needs to be delivered when it's needed, who cares?

But being in business means you would be aware of your situation and not 'realise' you are working two contracts. This is more towards stupidity than business I would have said.

[stek]

While my mate has recently got a new contract we realised that the same contractor is working two contracts at the same time

As one job is working from home and the other one is not much observed and he just shows up 2 days a week and works the rest from home.

What are the legal requirement for this? Shouldn't he not be bounded by contract not to work two roles at the same time? Both jobs are full time contracts.

Morally I think it’s wrong as he is trying to offload his work onto his co-workers and he is cashing in double day rate with doing the bare minimum?

He's probably more efficient than you.