Originally posted by fidot
View Post
-
Don't worry about that. Add some +ve reputation to my posts and I'll pass the thanks and likes on. -
Thanks for all the replies. I did try to "Thank" and "Like" individual posts, but it doesn't seem to be working.Leave a comment:
-
Copy the requirements for a company to be expemt in to a mail and send to the agents asking them to confirm their client meets all the criteria. If they reply confirming it is you'll have enought go ahead IMO.Leave a comment:
-
It isn't necessarily deceitful, but agents make mistakes all the time. Anyway, regarding what the OP can do, they can ask the client and check whatever public information is available but, at that point, it's Chapter 8 and due diligence, ideally with a confirmation of arrangements from the small client.Originally posted by northernladuk View PostLeave a comment:
-
Where this is true you'd think in this situation the client has done the diligence to find out what their legal obligations are here. I can get why agents would lie about an outside role but I can't see how any one wins lying about whether the client is exempt or not. Actually quite the opposite. If they've said that and the client isn't and gets a dirty great fine the agent can be held liable to cover the fine. One things agents are good at is covering their arses when when it comes to financial risk.Originally posted by jamesbrown View PostLeave a comment:
-
Indeed, but the OP was asking how they could verify the supplied information. The information has already been supplied as I understood the OP, although that is secondhand from an agent, so the starting assumption would be that it's completely made up.Originally posted by hobnob View PostLeave a comment:
-
"If you’re a small-sized client in the private sector you’ll not have to decide the employment status of your workers. This will remain the responsibility of the worker’s intermediary (usually a limited company). However, you must confirm your size if asked by the person or organisation you contract with, or the worker. This is to make sure that you, agencies and workers can consider what rules apply."Originally posted by fidot View Post
April 2021 changes to off-payroll working for clients - GOV.UK (www.gov.uk)Leave a comment:
-
Don't believe themOriginally posted by fidot View Post
Even if you do they aren't obligated to give you one until just before first payment at which point we are seeing client reversing the determination.I ask for a Status Determination
He then says the client is exempt due to its size (so first statement wasn't true - surprise!)- How can I verify if the client is exempt?
- Ask the agent. They should have done some diligence and the client most certainly should have. Ask to see that.
Correct with a big 'but' at the end.- If they are exempt, I believe that IR35 status is then my call (i.e. as it was when I used to freelance) Is that correct?
Correct- Irrespective of status, if I choose to go PAYE via an Umbrella, there is no risk from an IR35 perspective?
As unappealing as umbrellas are they do serve a purpose and worth considering in some circumstances. For a dip back in to test the water they aren't the worst option.The umbrella route is tempting as I'm not sure how long I'll contract for and it seems to be less hassle, even though I appreciate that will come at a reduction in money in my pocket.
So you say you are in charge of the determination which is true and you'll determine yourself outside like every contractor did ever. The problem you have now is, and this is in my opinion, nearly all the clients that are exempt from the criteria are the most IR35 unsafe roles out there. Like the bottom of the barrel so are the ones you should really be the most careful with. Small startups particularly, are just not set up to give one person a single task and leave them to it. They often need a flexible resource to come on the journey with them and takle whatever comes along. That's pure D&C. You get a set SOW that you expect you will stick to like glue where absolutely everyone else is wearing three hats. No chance.
So yes you make the determination but you are a pool of clients that are more likely than any others to fail the tests. Remember it's not the contract it's the working practices. Jury is out on small exempt companies but I wouldn't get much sleep working in an areas that is expempt (for now!!!) with a shakey IR35 status. We appear to disagree on whether this lot is the next target or it's too small for HMRC to come after but if HMRC have a black hole to fill anything could be game.
Leave a comment:
-
- You cannot really verify the client is exempt, beyond looking for public information in relation to the Companies Act 2006 definitions.
- Yes, Chapter 8 applies.
- Yes.
Leave a comment:
-
First Contract for 7 Years - sanity check
After 7 years on the dark side (actually, surprisingly enjoyable), I may be jumping back into contracting again due to redundancy. I've never worked under the IR35 regime where the client does the determination, so I'm just asking for a sanity check here.
Agent tells me the role is outside IR35
I ask for a Status Determination
He then says the client is exempt due to its size (so first statement wasn't true - surprise!)- How can I verify if the client is exempt?
- If they are exempt, I believe that IR35 status is then my call (i.e. as it was when I used to freelance) Is that correct?
- Irrespective of status, if I choose to go PAYE via an Umbrella, there is no risk from an IR35 perspective?
Thanks in Advance for any repliesLast edited by fidot; 3 March 2023, 15:35.
Leave a comment: