Reply to: IR35 PS - Calculator for rate WITHOUT Employer NI

[northernladuk]

To be honest, I am considering canning the whole idea. Im losing the will to live trying to sort it all out.

Please do. You aren't the only one.

Methinks they've decided its hassle and done this deliberately.

I'm surprised with you low opinion of agents you didn't consider this in the first place. It's probably the most likely conclusion.

[psychocandy]

To be honest, I am considering canning the whole idea. Im losing the will to live trying to sort it all out.

Good idea in principle but I think agency have "offered" this option without even thinking about how it works. They've given me a different rate now (with employer NI paid) and its lower than I calculated.

Methinks they've decided its hassle and done this deliberately.

[BrilloPad]

I have a feeling IPSE's first Public sector IR35 case may feature an interesting contractor.....

Interesting or Inneresting?

[northernladyuk]

We're ****ed then.

Unless we can get immunity by turning Queen's evidence on his benefit fraud ring.

[northernladuk]

I have a feeling IPSE's first Public sector IR35 case may feature an interesting contractor.....

We're ****ed then.

[eek]

I have a feeling IPSE's first Public sector IR35 case may feature an interesting contractor.....

[TheFaQQer]

Childcare - up to the max

But you're not employed by your limited company if someone else is paying the employers National Insurance. So I'd be extremely careful about claiming employee benefits based on your income that is earned as an employee of another company.

Which means your main saving is £5 per payslip, whereas your main costs are insurance and hassle.

[malvolio]

Not according to accountant.

Yes, according to other accountant. It's still income and expenditure. It may net out to zero but it has to be processed and reported.

Also expect a letter from the VAT man if you aren't making returns or claiming VAT refunds with no income.

[northernladyuk]

ha ha no jsa angle.....

It's OK. You're among friends.

[psychocandy]

So basically nothing (bar training) that a decent umbrella doesn't offer and you have to pay for the insurance out of income the company isn't receiving....

Technically given the fact your company isn't paying the Employers NI you are not actually an employee of that company. It wouldn't surprise me if HMRC decided to investigate the rest based on that - it would be an interesting case for a junior HMRC investigator to make a name for himself with....

Good point.... Not many umbrellas do childcare any more...

[psychocandy]

Are you thinking there is some kind of JSA angle here?

ha ha no jsa angle.....

[northernladyuk]

On point 2...I thought you can still claim expenses related to running your company can't you? It's just the T&S that's not allowed? I thought all that and the carry back carried on as normal...

You are still running your ltd, just not putting income through it at the moment?

Was thinking about the 'not actively trading' comment. Is that the case? You have no income coming through the company. Why is working through a brolly for a period any different to being on the bench when it comes to the company affairs? You could be on the look out for some sideline work to do in evenings/weekends so not quite not actively trading?

Are you thinking there is some kind of JSA angle here?

[northernladuk]

So basically nothing (bar training) that a decent umbrella doesn't offer and you have to pay for the insurance out of income the company isn't receiving....

What about mileage to attend interviews every day and lunch with your accountant 5 days a week. Valid business expenses surely while you inside surely

[northernladuk]

On point 2...I thought you can still claim expenses related to running your company can't you? It's just the T&S that's not allowed? I thought all that and the carry back carried on as normal...

You are still running your ltd, just not putting income through it at the moment?

Was thinking about the 'not actively trading' comment. Is that the case? You have no income coming through the company. Why is working through a brolly for a period any different to being on the bench when it comes to the company affairs? You could be on the look out for some sideline work to do in evenings/weekends so not quite not actively trading?

[eek]

OK, where the savings are:-

1) £5 per payslip instead of £20+ for umbrella. (Although this is cancelled out somewhat by need to pay for insurance now).

2) Additional expenses that can be claimed (and carried back as a loss) which can't be if Im employed by umbrella.

Childcare - up to the max
Training/subscriptions - safari online costs me £130+vat per year.
Miscellaneous stuff.

Stuff I have to pay more for:-

1) Accountant fees are half whilst with umbrella but full while using properly.


Not much in it admitedly, but for those of who want to keep our limited it'd be nice to use it still....

So basically nothing (bar training) that a decent umbrella doesn't offer and you have to pay for the insurance out of income the company isn't receiving....

Technically given the fact your company isn't paying the Employers NI you are not actually an employee of that company. It wouldn't surprise me if HMRC decided to investigate the rest based on that - it would be an interesting case for a junior HMRC investigator to make a name for himself with....