Sympathy for the Devil

[BrownOwl]

I very much agree with the last para (erm...though as a tax advisor I should prob state I'm not suggesting to fleeing to Saudi Arabia). Rather I think getting the figures for all options and then considering is sensible.

Thanks for the advice.

By requesting the figures from HMRC is there a chance I am being tricked into admitting I am a tax avoider and then I'm liable for whatever HMRC decide?

Also, I guess it's the case that HMRC already have all the data for my payments from the intensive investigations they did over the past (nearly) 20 years. Do I just have to check those match with my figures and don't have to actually disclose anything they don't already have?

By disclosing my payments I fear HMRC could use that against me if it ever does get to a court as I'm effectively admitting I'm a tax avoider.

[BrownOwl]

Hi, i cant guarantee at this stage and would be wrong of me to state otherwise. I am hopeful though and noises coming out of HMRC seems to indicate the certainty we crave will be possible to include in the settlement. Until then though its not certain but ill update as and when I hear. As ive said to people who have called me, if the settlement doesn't include it then I will not be advising to sign the deeds until it suits each individuals aims. For the majority id say this includes wanting a definite and final end to the matter. HMRC recognise this so fingers crossed all agreed soon.
It still stands that we can ask for it on a case by cases basis anyway and I would find it strange if HMRC refused as we would effectively be asking to include something they are already saying verbally.
Sorry its all as clear as mud but we are working on it and for once I am being mildly optimistic as I think will soon be resolved.

Phil

Great. Sounds promising.

[regron]

I'm happy to ask that as I can ask for anything to be included, plus your theory about 'why would they have a problem if so confident" is sound and based on common sense but...honestly id be amazed if they ran with it (its HMRC and common sense we are talking about).So unless they shock me and agree I cant offer a service promising such a thing. Id say the chances of them agreeing are extremely minimal to say the least.
Ill let you know if that changes though. As I say, I'm happy to ask as no harm I guess.
What you mention is the main query people have to ask themselves I guess...'do I want to the risk of letting it run and potentially having a great result or just accept a more certain one now'. Not for me or indeed anyone to say what the best answer is as purely down to the individual and their own perception of acceptable risk. Sorry that's not helpful but there's no definite correct answer. It wouldn't be helpful if I said what id do either as some of us are risk takers and some risk averse.

All that being said, keep an eye out for the thread ill be posting tomorrow regarding HMRC behaviours/the press. (Please don't get hopes up here - its nothing life changing and unlikely to change the above answer but it is vaguely linked).

Regards,
Phil

Hi Phil,

Did you post this thread you spoke of yesterday ? If so, I can't find it.

[phil@pmtc]

Hi Phil,

Did you post this thread you spoke of yesterday ? If so, I can't find it.

Hi, sorry no, I will be doing but having to check something first. Will be tomorrow I think. Apologies for being annoying! Also, I should add its nothing which is worth getting hopes up for. More something of interest.

[regron]

Hi, sorry no, I will be doing but having to check something first. Will be tomorrow I think. Apologies for being annoying! Also, I should add its nothing which is worth getting hopes up for. More something of interest.

Ok Phil cheers. Don't worry, I have spent the last god knows how many years in this mess, so chucked in the 'Getting my hopes up' towel yonks ago

[PokemonStay]

If you were to take corrective action then i would expect you should be able to get a refund.

Do you actually believe that?

[phil@pmtc]

Do you actually believe that?

Hi.
If it was overturned in court, then yes and i've seen it occur. As my previous posts hopefully show, I would not state so if I didn't think possible as there's no benefit whatsoever in me raising hopes unnecessarily.
That being said, I'm not saying its guaranteed either but simply that it has happened in the past.

[webberg]

Graham, it's utterly exhausting discussing anything with you. You speak in riddles and constantly change your story. It's clear to me you are just here to sell Big Group. Anything other than that you dismiss; fair enough you believe in your resolution strategy - but I am far from convinced. I thought WTT could still arrange settlement for me, but I'll be going elsewhere.

As you wish.

The only settlement we can get is what HMRC offer and as I have said from day 1 on this (i.e. have never changed my "story") that is not negotiable.

I'm sure Phil, whose thread we seem to have taken over (apologies) can get you that deal as can dozens of others.

Good luck.

[difficulttimes]

I'm sure Phil, whose thread we seem to have taken over (apologies) can get you that deal as can dozens of others.

Good luck.

In fairness to Phil he isn't talking about a deal. I think we all need to admit that there ARE NO DEALS.

HMRC offer no deals...if you aren't able to speak with HMRC on settlement and you want support thats where a tax advisor like Phil come in but there are no deals because people will think that a 'deal' is paying less than you would have through CLSO2 and that is definitely not the case.

I think everyone impacted by this and reads this forum that there are no financial deals. The only deal is with TTP but you will still pay 100% what is owed according to HMRC.

Sorry but I'm just concerned that people have been given false hope. I moved on from there about 3 years ago, even before the loan charge when the government introduced APNs.. money I knew I was never ever going to get back once I paid.

[BrownOwl]

Hi.
If it was overturned in court, then yes and i've seen it occur. As my previous posts hopefully show, I would not state so if I didn't think possible as there's no benefit whatsoever in me raising hopes unnecessarily.
That being said, I'm not saying its guaranteed either but simply that it has happened in the past.

Hi Phil,

Could the tax paid under the 2019 legislation be refunded if that legislation was challenged and overturned in the future?

The issue with the settlement opportunity is that because I would be voluntarily paying tax, I am effectively pleading guilty to being a tax avoider (without any proof from HMRC, I must add) and would never see that money again under any circumstance.