Taxation is theft

[SpontaneousOrder]

You ask some very ill thought out and melodramatic questions. How old are you?

My questions become seemingly more ridiculous because you go to ridiculous efforts to evade answering the question.

The US idea of law makes it quite clear that the crimes of rape and murder would have taken place.

That's being deliberately obtuse because you already know its a hypothetical scenario in order to illustrate a point, so it's perfectly reasonable to also suppose a hypothetically different set of laws in the US.

So...

Even if it didn't, many observers or historians might conclude that rape and murder took place based on their own definition of such things.

But you just told me that personal definitions aren't what counts You said that whether theft, murder, rape etc had occurred was dependant on the law, which was determined by the majority with the force to back it up

[doodab]

But you just told me that personal definitions aren't what counts

When it comes to legislation and making law.

To relate it back to your original point, you can say that "theft" occurred when you pay your taxes if you like, but ultimately no crime was committed under the law. Only people who buy your definition of theft need agree with you.

[SpontaneousOrder]

Only people who buy your definition of theft need agree with you.

That's the point. Law exists because of things like theft, not the other way around. To try to reverse the cause & effect wouldn't make any sense.

So deliberately choosing the present legal definition of theft in order to justify taxation and the violence used to collect it is to deliberately ignore the context and play with semantics in order to reach a justification.

Language reflects reality - it doesn't define it.

[doodab]

Language reflects reality - it doesn't define it.

And we have different words for taxation and theft. What does that tell you?

Theft is theft. A monkey can steal a peanut from another monkey.

Taxation is something done by some prevailing authority, usually with the, sometimes reluctant, agreement of those being taxed, and usually involved getting something in return.

They are different things.

This is a stupid discussion. I have better things to do I'm afraid.

[SpontaneousOrder]

And we have different words for taxation and theft. What does that tell you?

Theft is theft. A monkey can steal a peanut from another monkey.

Taxation is something done by some prevailing authority, usually with the, sometimes reluctant, agreement of those being taxed, and usually involved getting something in return.

They are different things.

This is a stupid discussion. I have better things to do I'm afraid.

By conspicuously avoiding the US invading and raping and murdering question, I conclude that "better things to do" means "better than being shown up"

[xoggoth]

It's called "might is right". It might annoy bleeding heart wishy washy tree-hugging sandal wearing hippies, but ultimately all authority derives from who controls the people with guns.

Indeed. What a very practical chap you are! Most rare among CUKers. Although, if you exclude any notion of what is moral or right or even best for society as more sensible people would define it, then anything that works or that one can get away with, including tax evasion, is equally valid.

[speling bee]

Well I've missed this joyful discussion and CBA to read it all. But if taxation is theft, so what?

[Gym beast]

The law of the land is the correct one because it can be imposed on you by force. Their police force is bigger than yours, and, ultimately, their army is bigger than yours.


Their law wins over your opinion (you don't have any legislation, that's just being silly), because it's backed by people with guns. If you are a US citizen, then "it's backed by people with far bigger and more guns".

If you feel that calling someone a **** is perfectly acceptable under your rules for this forum, and Cojak thinks it isn't, then Cojak's rules wins, because she has the ban-hammer, and you don't. You then hack the server to implement your rule, and admin calls PC Plod to take you away.

It's called "might is right". It might annoy bleeding heart wishy washy tree-hugging sandal wearing hippies, but ultimately all authority derives from who controls the people with guns.

The keyboard is mightier than the F-22, son.

[SpontaneousOrder]

So, to sum up, like, tax really is theft by those with the biggest guns.



I'd sort of thought that.

Not rocket science, is it.

[SpontaneousOrder]

Well I've missed this joyful discussion and CBA to read it all. But if taxation is theft, so what?

It's a thread not related to UKIP