More Farage wisdom

[vetran]

I asked the bookshop owner for the new book by Nick Clegg.

"I think I've sold out," he replied.

I said, "That's the one!"

[Mich the Tester]

The Euro represents a mercantilist strategy for Germany to lock in at a lower exchange rate with Southern Europe, so as to boost exports . This is of course in addition to being efficient at producing quality goods.

Do you have evidence to show that this was the motive for the German government? Are you ignoring the fact that West Germany was already a very wealthy industrial power on the back of a strong Deutschmark? Or that the Germans pushed for strict budget laws for Euro membership (and then admittedly broke them) because they wanted it to be a strong currency?

[sasguru]

Yes and Honda UK in Swindon have had a blood bath in their head count because the market in the EU has been hit so hard by the austerity measures they've had to impose as a result of their pig headed currency union project.

Meanwhile, their cars are selling very well in the rest of the world

Utter bollocks. How come Nissan in Sunderland are working 3 shifts to cope with demand from Europe and elsewhere - the Qashqai is selling like hotcakes in Europe and elsewhere, designed, engineered and built in Britain, the only thing Jap about it is the badge.
As someone else has noted, Honda has been producing unattractive cars for ages.

My point is that the burgeoning success story in British car manufacturing is due entirely to inward foreign investment to access European markets. Several of these firms have stated categorically that they will move out if the UK leaves the Euro.
Them leaving will not just mean the direct jobs lost but the additional jobs that have been created by the growing supply chain for the car industries.

I'm willing to bet that very few car workers in the UK will be voting UKIP.

[Old Greg]

Do you have evidence to show that this was the motive for the German government? Are you ignoring the fact that West Germany was already a very wealthy industrial power on the back of a strong Deutschmark? Or that the Germans pushed for strict budget laws for Euro membership (and then admittedly broke them) because they wanted it to be a strong currency?

Evidence? Don't be silly. It's about analysis and balancing different arguments and coming to a considered view. Here's some reading Germany displaces China as US Treasury's currency villain - Telegraph

People are ready to blame those countries that run trade deficits, but for every deficit there is a surplus, so the surplus countries need to look at their domestic consumption among other things. The way China and Germany run their surplus (the argument goes) is via currency manipulation: in Germany's case by locking it at a low rate into the Euro.

The strong German economy before the Great Recession gave an important base for this, but the question is, how has it managed to ride the recession? And the answer that this argument gives is: in part, through exploiting a mercantilist advantage via the Euro.

[Mich the Tester]

Evidence? Don't be silly. It's about analysis and balancing different arguments and coming to a considered view. Here's some reading Germany displaces China as US Treasury's currency villain - Telegraph

People are ready to blame those countries that run trade deficits, but for every deficit there is a surplus, so the surplus countries need to look at their domestic consumption among other things. The way China and Germany run their surplus (the argument goes) is via currency manipulation: in Germany's case by locking it at a low rate into the Euro.

The strong German economy before the Great Recession gave an important base for this, but the question is, how has it managed to ride the recession? And the answer that this argument gives is: in part, through exploiting a mercantilist advantage via the Euro.

Ah, now you're talking about a mercantilist advantage which they gained after moving to the euro, and not a 'strategy', which would suggest that they had planned it to work this way; I don't believe that they did.

[Old Greg]

Ah, now you're talking about a mercantilist advantage which they gained after moving to the euro, and not a 'strategy', which would suggest that they had planned it to work this way; I don't believe that they did.

I'm just using words imprecisely as this is not a court of law.

[Mich the Tester]

I'm just using words imprecisely as this is not a court of law.

Fair enough. I've heard too much of this theory that it's a plan by the Germans; I don't think it is and in fact the Germans I know are not entirely comfortable with any appearance of wanting to dominate Europe.

[DodgyAgent]

Do you have evidence to show that this was the motive for the German government? Are you ignoring the fact that West Germany was already a very wealthy industrial power on the back of a strong Deutschmark? Or that the Germans pushed for strict budget laws for Euro membership (and then admittedly broke them) because they wanted it to be a strong currency?

The weakness of your defence is to challenge someone to produce information that you know perfectly well is impossible to find. So let me ask you can you prove this wasn't Germanys motive?

I prefer to look at outcomes and to follow the money. The Euro has enabled Germany to keep the cost of its goods very low. It has eradicated any price and cost advantages that lower cost/ poorer countries might have to bolster their economies.

What is quite hilarious is that your whole argument is dismantled when ypu say " the Germans pushed for strict budget laws for Euro membership (and then admittedly broke them)" . Did they break them by accident? Is this what the German chancellor said " we accidentally let the greeks and spanish and Irish and Portuguese in.. of course we didn't mean to.. Guess what has happened.. you won't believe this but our currency is so low that the Italian and Spanish manufacturing industries cannot compete with us!"

[sasguru]

People are ready to blame those countries that run trade deficits, but for every deficit there is a surplus, so the surplus countries need to look at their domestic consumption among other things. .

Classic bien-pensant Anglo-Saxon justification for our lack of economic discipline, I'm afraid.
Historically the German economy has always thrived (at least when they've been politically stable) because they make quality products and culturally they're not shallow enough to fall into a consumption mentality.

I'm not arguing that having the Euro as it is hasn't helped them, especially during the recession - just that they would probably thrive whatever ( at least after the Haartz reforms).

[Mich the Tester]

The weakness of your defence is to challenge someone to produce information that you know perfectly well is impossible to find. So let me ask you can you prove this wasn't Germanys motive?

Oh dear, asking someone to prove a negative.