IR35 is dead

[TheScarletPimp]

You see, this is one of those things that annoys me about the PCG.
They claim to be representative of all contractors, not just their members.

Stuff like this should be made public. It seems petty for them to keep such information as members only.

Really, and who died and left you in charge in that case? Information found in the PCG Forums is confidential and for members only. Which part of that sentence do you have difficulty with because I'd be only too happy to help explain?

TSP

[v8gaz]

The point is that this rumour is likely to have one of two effects.
1. People will believe it and start ignorring IR35.
2. People will ignore it and continue with their IR35 defences.

Either way the PCG should be trying to find out and make an official statement.
This rumour is dangerous. The PCG claims to be our voice. This needs addressing.

Oh yes, and **** off with the patronising little throw aways.

Yes, this rumour is dangerous. That's why it should not be published in the public domain by idiot tossers who think they're being clever.

[TheScarletPimp]

The IR insider news is of concern to all contractors, not just PCG members. If they want to claim to be representative then they should be happy with this stuff going public.
They should have put it on their public pages with their views on the subject.

Otherwise they are an unrepresentative members only club and should have no voice as far as contractors are concerned.

It's debatable whether the original poster of the information on the PCG Forums should have posted it. What's not debatable is that those who subsequently posted those private posts on this forum broke the Ts&Cs of the PCG Forums and these forums at the same time.

Those posts were private and you have no business claiming that they should be made public. They are not your concern as you are not a member. What the PCG does on the behalf of its members is a matter for its members first and foremost. The PCG is answerable to its members only so unless you can be bothered joining why don't you just quit whining?

TSP

[TheScarletPimp]

The PCG has set itself up as the "official" voice of contracting.
A rumour like this is bound to get out and as it occured on their fora they have a duty to all contractors, including their members, to research the rumour and publish on it.
If they can not do such a thing then they should back away from the table and stop claiming to be the voice of contracting.

IR35 is the reason the PCG formed, it is the single biggest issue for contractors and a rumour like this is either great news or very dangerous to all of us. How can teh PCG sit back and say it is nothing to do with them.

Get over yourself man. The PCG is not in the business of investigating rumours or jumping at the requests of lone nutcases on anonymous bulletin boards.

The PCG is the voice of its members and its members only. Others may benefit from the actions of the PCG, and many have, but that's merely their good fortune.

TSP

[TheScarletPimp]

The point is that this rumour is likely to have one of two effects.
1. People will believe it and start ignorring IR35.
2. People will ignore it and continue with their IR35 defences.

Either way the PCG should be trying to find out and make an official statement.
This rumour is dangerous. The PCG claims to be our voice. This needs addressing.

Oh yes, and **** off with the patronising little throw aways.

You really are losing the plot here aren't you? The rumour changes nothing. Anyone believing it does deserves all they get. The PCG isn't in the business of depriving the Darwin Awards of potential award winners. The more easy meat for the IR the better I like it personally as it becomes less and less likely that HMRC will come after the awkward customers in the PCG.

TSR

[Board Game Geek]

Would it not have been better to say "Allegedly, from an authorititive, members only source, I have heard the following information..." and then paraphrased the PCG discussion ?

This would not have contravened any T&C's, as hearsay is not actionable.

Unless of course the PCG have stamped "Top Secret" on the discussion and asked members to sign a confidentiality agreement :-)

[TheScarletPimp]

I was a member. I just missed the 50 quid membership fee. I joined because I felt IR35 was wrong. Even though I was working abroad at the time and IR35 was not going to touch me. I joined because I felt it was the right thing to do.

Since then I have felt that the PCG is more and more interested in its own existance than with the welbeing of its members or contractors in general.
It is becoming less and less the voice of contractors and more and more the voice of the PCG.

Is that a problem? Does my being a member make my point any less relevant?
It is going to be difficult to slag of NL or the BNP if I have to be a member to do so!

None of your points are relevant mate. You haven't got a clue what's going on inside the PCG however you don't seem to be put off opining despite a complete lack of knowledge or understanding. Keep up the bad work.

TSP

[TheScarletPimp]

Just to say I agree 100% with The Lone Gunman. The PCG is there to further the PCGs aims - maybe at first it attempted to be representative of the majority of contractors views, but you know the saying, absolute power corrupts absolutely. It has a monopoly in it's niche in the contracting world and boy does it behave like it. It does not speak for all contractors IMO. It provides useful services for contractors (advice, contracts, insurance deals etc), but speak for all contractors it does not.

100% huh? That really makes you a man worth listening to then.

TSM

[TheScarletPimp]

First of all, I agree with S660a. It's a blatent tax dodge as far as I'm concerned, and whilst I know we all look for ways to optimise our tax there is a line where it strays into tax evasion which the Arctic people crossed IMO. Evading tax is cheating everyone. I also agree with IR35 up to a point. I don't agree with it for short term contracts, but if the contract lasts for more than a year, then IMO that is also tax evasion as you really are a disguised employee - certainly in the IT sector. IR35 would be fair I think if time constraints were added.

The people who are effectively perma-temps or people who are blatently taking the piss over tax are not the kind of people the PCG should be touting as hard-done-by. It gives us all a bad name and is the reason why Gordon Brown is probably at this very moment thinking about IR35 - the sequel.

The persueding agencies thing is a joke. They're not listening. They don't have to. Why do they care? They've got a plentiful supply of people who don't know their arse from their elbow in the contracting world. What the PCG should be doing is targetting contractors to educate them and putting the pressure on the agencies in that way. But, as I said before, the PCG don't seem to want to listen to lowly contractors, the top brass have their own agendas.



To be honest, that's got bugger all to do with the PCG. That's down to the excellent work by Accountax, Lawspeed, Bauer & Cottrell etc etc.

Since you don't appear to understand the difference between tax evasion and avoidance I suggest that you stop posting until you have a clue what you're talking about. Provided no tax laws are broken then everyone is entitled to make use of any tax saving device they and their professional advisors see fit.

If you disagree with the above I suggest you apply for a permie, wage slave position and leave contracting to those appreciate it.

TSP

[TheScarletPimp]

It's just an opinion. Whether it's the law of the land is not the point. We can all disagree with laws, yes?

Absolutely. Suicide is against the law. Any chance you'd disagree with that one?

TSP