Interesting documentary so far

[VectraMan]

Communist system - no-one can be unemployed because the government always gives you a job.

Also Labour's new flagship policy.

[vetran]

Communist system - no-one can be unemployed because the government always gives you a job.

Bad idea IMHO

nope not communist very capitalist, anyone who isn't contributing has to be made to. More Gulag than over staffed Tractor factory.

These jobs won't be cushy or theirs to abuse, they will be hard & unpleasant and if they decide they don't want to do them they don't get benefits.

[minestrone]

There is a fair percentage of people in this country that just don't have the skills to hold down the most basic job, it would not be worth the hassle forcing them into a position of employment, it is best they are given some money and left to do what they want with their time.

[doodab]

There is a fair percentage of people in this country that just don't have the skills to hold down the most basic job, it would not be worth the hassle forcing them into a position of employment, it is best they are given some money and left to do what they want with their time.

WHS. Abolishing the house of lords would be a disaster.

[SpontaneousOrder]

nope not communist very capitalist, anyone who isn't contributing has to be made to. More Gulag than over staffed Tractor factory.

These jobs won't be cushy or theirs to abuse, they will be hard & unpleasant and if they decide they don't want to do them they don't get benefits.

I don't see how that is capitalist in any imaginable way.

Apart from that, if those jobs are hard and unpleasant, then what makes you think that they need to be 'given' them? There is always work to be done, despite popular opinion.

[vetran]

I don't see how that is capitalist in any imaginable way.

Apart from that, if those jobs are hard and unpleasant, then what makes you think that they need to be 'given' them? There is always work to be done, despite popular opinion.

so what would you do with the institutionalised unemployed?

The ones that want to escape need experience to get a job, the ones that don't want to need a reason to get a job. The ones that are working illegally need to be kept busy so they can't work or give up benefits to work.

We could just leave them to it and have a feral underclass but that is already causing problems.

[Peoplesoft bloke]

nope not communist very capitalist, anyone who isn't contributing has to be made to. More Gulag than over staffed Tractor factory.

These jobs won't be cushy or theirs to abuse, they will be hard & unpleasant and if they decide they don't want to do them they don't get benefits.

You haven't read much about the former (and current) communist states by the sounds of it. If your idea of Communism is lurking around in a tractor factory not doing much work I think you have missed quite a bit. Try being forced to turn up and work hard without any certainty of getting paid and being able to buy anything if paid.

Capitalism isn't providing jobs for some people. Creating jobs that otherwise wouldn't exist as a punishment is the workhouse made modern. It certainly isn't capitalism, which would present these people with the steal or starve options.

[vetran]

You haven't read much about the former (and current) communist states by the sounds of it. If your idea of Communism is lurking around in a tractor factory not doing much work I think you have missed quite a bit. Try being forced to turn up and work hard without any certainty of getting paid and being able to buy anything if paid.

Capitalism isn't providing jobs for some people. Creating jobs that otherwise wouldn't exist as a punishment is the workhouse made modern. It certainly isn't capitalism, which would present these people with the steal or starve options.

The tractor factory meme is commonly taken as the falsifying production figures to avoid punishment for failure to achieve (normally incorrect government targets). I suppose I should have extended it to the British Leyland type implementation but I did compare it to a Gulag a whole different level of unpleasantness so the comparison stands.

You realise both Conservatives & Labour are looking at enforced workfare for long term unemployed so its mainstream policy. The home of rampant capitalism has a workfare policy in full swing. So I suggest its a very up to date capitalist policy.

Workfare - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

We abolished the workhouse and saw the growth of the unemployable underclass, I don't want to see the reintroduction of workhouses they were abhorrent.

The rise and fall of the workhouse | History Extra

Apparently we can't reduce the imported workforce to make labour scarce and the employers willing to take a chance on less attractive employees. So how do we get people who are happy on benefit into employment and out of a destructive life on benefits?

[lukemg]

There is a fair percentage of people in this country that just don't have the skills to hold down the most basic job, it would not be worth the hassle forcing them into a position of employment, it is best they are given some money and left to do what they want with their time.

WHS, it's the price of doing business. Otherwise we have to live in walled compounds like in Brazil and SA. Bung them enough to keep quiet and we can get on with our lives.
Yes, you can piss around at the margins but there is a hardcore of unemployables in every country, get enough cash to move further away from them and get on with your life.

[vetran]

WHS, it's the price of doing business. Otherwise we have to live in walled compounds like in Brazil and SA. Bung them enough to keep quiet and we can get on with our lives.
Yes, you can piss around at the margins but there is a hardcore of unemployables in every country, get enough cash to move further away from them and get on with your life.

how depressing. I would suspect there are far fewer unemployables than you imagine, also if you keep them busy then crime may well fall.