Crimewatch - Madeleine McCann

[MyUserName]

They were in a camp that affords a level of security that is otherwise not present.

That might be true but, like I said in a previous post, what happens if they wake up after a nightmare or wake up, call you and get scared because there is no answer etc.?

I do not stay near my kids because I think that they will be snatched the moment I blink. I do it because I want to make sure they know they have a safe, stable environment and there is always someone to look after them whether it is me, Mrs MUN, their teacher etc.

Even when we do medieval shows (where we know everyone in the camp they would soon intercede if someone they did not recognise tried taking on my kids) we take it turns going to the beer tent, one of us always stays in the tent with the kids in case something happens. I am happy to do it.

[DodgyAgent]

No, but it doesn't make it right. I'd venture the other 7 haven't left their kids alone since...

Safety in numbers. Like everything else it is a matter of risk. What seriously are the chances of a child being abducted like this? The Mcanns took a risk that millions of others take day in day out. The self righteous amongst us who probably smother their own children in cotton wool are only too happy to jump on this cruel bandwagon and ignore the true guilty party.

[Churchill]

OK so the fault lies with the Mcanns? The danger of judging others and blaming the victims (which is what you are doing) has the unintended consequence of setting rules that inconveniently apply to other situation. So again let me ask you. If the Mcanns are at fault for leaving their kids unattended and the responsibility for their abduction is theirs then presumably any girl who is not covered from head to toe in rags is just asking to be raped. Or if she is raped having worn next to nothing then she has to take some part of the blame?

You've got this obsession with regards to scantily clad women and rape, leave it out of the debate, you're muddying the waters.

The parents left their children alone, something happened resulting in the disappearance of their daughter.

If they hadn't left the child alone then perhaps the child wouldn't have disappeared.

The daughter is the victim here, the parents are culpable with regards to her disappearance.

[Hairy]

So what would you think if the parents had slipped out for 15 minutes for a drink at the bar? You have stated the principle that fault lies with the parents(that the Mcanns have only themselves to blame) that children should not be left alone (should parents even be allowed to go to sleep for that matter?). So are you saying it is an absolute? or do you have a time limit when parents can take their eyes off their children?

Technically, no. The other day, I literally turned my back to see who was calling my mobile, to look down and find my 2 year old in the dishwasher playing with a global knife.

However, I would never, ever, leave my kids alone, without supervision. I wouldn’t leave them in the car and pop in to do the weekly shopping, nothing.

I’ve never wanted to comment on others parenting methods, as it’s a tremendously tricky job, it’s hard work, and what works for some people, works for others. However, on this one, I would call their behaviour wrong.

[cailin maith]

So what would you think if the parents had slipped out for 15 minutes for a drink at the bar?

Exactly the bloody same.

They shouldn't have left the kids alone in an apartment they could not see from where they were - why is that so difficult to accept?

[Mich the Tester]

I wonder how old some of the other kids in the appartment block were; at least one was 12 years old, maybe some were older and people expected they'd keep an eye on the younger kids too, or maybe asked them to do that. I did a few very short babysits (an hour or so) for young kids when I was 12, so obviously someone thought I was responsible enough to do that. In fact, come to think of it, I probably was. I had my moments of teenage delinquency but if I had to look after someone's kid I was basically trustworthy.

[geoffreywhereveryoumaybe]

There was a nightly creche in the complex where they could have left the children safely but they didn't take that option

[cailin maith]

There was a nightly creche in the complex where they could have left the children safely but they didn't take that option

Yeah, I didn't realise till last night that there was a creche in the place.

[MaryPoppins]

So what would you think if the parents had slipped out for 15 minutes for a drink at the bar? You have stated the principle that fault lies with the parents(that the Mcanns have only themselves to blame) that children should not be left alone (should parents even be allowed to go to sleep for that matter?). So are you saying it is an absolute? or do you have a time limit when parents can take their eyes off their children?

Have I at any point actually said that they only have themselves to blame?

No.

I have said that they made a decision that was in my opinion, a stupid one which led to something happening to one of their children. Not that they are to blame.

I think most of us would agree that leaving the building is slightly different to going to sleep.

Thank goodness some of you haven't chosen to breed.

[DodgyAgent]

That might be true but, like I said in a previous post, what happens if they wake up after a nightmare or wake up, call you and get scared because there is no answer etc.?

I do not stay near my kids because I think that they will be snatched the moment I blink. I do it because I want to make sure they know they have a safe, stable environment and there is always someone to look after them whether it is me, Mrs MUN, their teacher etc.

Even when we do medieval shows (where we know everyone in the camp they would soon intercede if someone they did not recognise tried taking on my kids) we take it turns going to the beer tent, one of us always stays in the tent with the kids in case something happens. I am happy to do it.

Usually Mark Warner have roaming baby sitters that listen out for screaming kids. I agree with you on that point, and yes the Mcanns and all the others should be more responsible and be told so. However the abducting of a child has no grounds for parental blame whatsoever and we start going down the road of "serving them right" then we are opening a whole can of worms about the relationship between the crime, the victim and the perpetrator. At what point for instance does the victim take responsibility for the committing of the crime?