Zero hours contracts

[DodgyAgent]

My daughter has a part time job at Gilly Hicks (part of Abercrombie and Fitch) in Westfield, White City, this is on a zero hour contract and it just dire, sometimes she gets shifts and sometimes she doesn't.

She sometimes has to ring in to see if they need her and quite often they don't.

It is very frustrating for her and she never knows from one week to the next what her hours will be, she is looking for an alternative but nothing around.

This isn't so bad for her as she live with me, and therefore won't be in major tulip if she doesn't have any income, sadly this also applies to people who do have rent to pay but get stung by not being allocated any shifts.

People looking for part time jobs should avoid Gilly Hicks, Abercrombie, Hollister IMHO, as there "contracts" are rubbish.

There is a dire shortage of overhead linemen and cabling people. These are High voltage electricians. The jobs do not require University degrees but they do require hard work in all sorts of conditions. The whole world is short of these people except the Philippines.

Top 10 Issues Facing Today's Linemen | Overhead Distribution content from TDWorld

So why doesn't she go and learn to be an electrician?

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

Depends. If you have money in the bank, live in an area with possibilities (or are able to move), and a decent education then sure. Sadly some of the abuse takes place where the only schools are sink schools, the children going to those schools have no chance of doing well no matter how bright they are, the local industries (mining, shipbuilding, steel, whatever) have shut and the way the state sponsors council housing means folk have to stay in those areas even when all the decent jobs have gone. Even the best decent people in these areas currently have no chance, not the current generation and not the generation going through the schools. A ruthless employer setting up a warehouse or whatever with such people in the catchment area can abuse rubbish contracts very easily and the workers have little opportunity to do anything else.

If the economy is that bad in those areas then isn't the chance of some work, for experience and to add to a cv, better than none? Also in such a deprived area I would be surprised if a business would be making the sort of margins that would enable them to meet the financial obligations of a full time employer in their first year or so of trading.

[Zippy]

I realise that I will probably be castigated for this remark but don't we all have a choice? Haven't most of you got good careers because you invested in your education and made wise choices about your future? Zero hours contracts work for some people - if they don't work then shouldn't the individual think about re-training, expanding their skill set and then look for something better

[cowers under table]

No, apperntly we don't all have a choice(because if there was one my neighbour wouldn't be paying to not work). As I pointed out earlier this 'flexibility' is all one way. It sounds great being able to pick and choose when you work but it doesn't work that way in practice. So, you turn up for a shift and your employer says 'sorry no work'. Fine - it's in your contract. You fail to turn up for a shift and it's a disciplinary offence. I've seen the contract and I couldn't believe it. It's tulip
Now all that it OK for us because we can charge a decent sum when we do work and put money aside for the lean times. It's a little more tricky to do that on £6.19 per hour.

PS don't get me started on the tax credits subsidy for these sharks.

[CoolCat]

If the economy is that bad in those areas then isn't the chance of some work, for experience and to add to a cv, better than none? Also in such a deprived area I would be surprised if a business would be making the sort of margins that would enable them to meet the financial obligations of a full time employer in their first year or so of trading.

I have seen big multinationals setup warehouses, call centres, and such like in these areas. They made money from day one because its just like outsourcing, they take the hit on the quality of the staff but know their labour costs are going to be rock bottom. So meeting the financial obligations of a full time employer in their first year wouldnt be a problem.

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

No, apperntly we don't all have a choice(because if there was one my neighbour wouldn't be paying to not work). As I pointed out earlier this 'flexibility' is all one way. It sounds great being able to pick and choose when you work but it doesn't work that way in practice. So, you turn up for a shift and your employer says 'sorry no work'. Fine - it's in your contract. You fail to turn up for a shift and it's a disciplinary offence. I've seen the contract and I couldn't believe it. It's tulip
Now all that it OK for us because we can charge a decent sum when we do work and put money aside for the lean times. It's a little more tricky to do that on £6.19 per hour.

PS don't get me started on the tax credits subsidy for these sharks.

I can see that the contracts are inequitable but the point I was trying to make is that people do have a choice - the Government offers subsidised and even fully funded training courses.

No I won't get you started on the tax credits subsidy

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

I have seen big multinationals setup warehouses, call centres, and such like in these areas. They made money from day one because its just like outsourcing, they take the hit on the quality of the staff but know their labour costs are going to be rock bottom. So meeting the financial obligations of a full time employer in their first year wouldnt be a problem.

Well if they take a hit on the quality of their staff they will eventually take a hit on their profits

[CoolCat]

Well if they take a hit on the quality of their staff they will eventually take a hit on their profits

nope. some things are more price sensitive than quality sensitive.

is the telco company with the best rated, best customer feedback, customer call centre making the most money? or the one outsourcing it to the cheapest workers possible? at the moment its usually the one using the cheapest workers possible.

so its only state regulation which can keep the bottom rung on the ladder in place. left to free market we would have slavery, children sweeping chimneys, etc.

but you are right in the sense i would like to see all Brits have much better chances, decent schools, not be trapped in a council house ghetto etc

[Bunk]

It is similar to contracting in one way. The employer/client shifts all the risk onto the worker, so that they're not committed to a long term employment contract and the costs that go with that. The difference is that the employee isn't compensated for taking the risk, like we are.

[eek]

It is similar to contracting in one way. The employer/client shifts all the risk onto the worker, so that they're not committed to a long term employment contract and the costs that go with that. The difference is that the employee isn't compensated for taking the risk, like we are.

WBS.

Its one thing for a well paid contractor to take the risk its another thing when its a zero hour contract on £7 an hour or nothing. We need to remember there are entire industries built around this lowest price mentality and we'll all be subject to them when we get older.

[LisaContractorUmbrella]

nope. some things are more price sensitive than quality sensitive.

is the telco company with the best rated, best customer feedback, customer call centre making the most money? or the one outsourcing it to the cheapest workers possible? at the moment its usually the one using the cheapest workers possible.

so its only state regulation which can keep the bottom rung on the ladder in place. left to free market we would have slavery, children sweeping chimneys, etc.

but you are right in the sense i would like to see all Brits have much better chances, decent schools, not be trapped in a council house ghetto etc

So do you think that the onus should be on the State to ensure that people are better educated and to take them out of the poverty 'trap' rather than on the individual?