The House of Lords...

[xoggoth]

Seriously, hereditary peers, a lot of rich toffs who have inherited land and titles, are somehow going to be more democratic and in touch with the ordinary people than the usual politicians? I think that's rewriting history slightly.

[threaded]

Yes.

You think an upper house filled with career politicians owing patronage to some party leader is going to be more in touch with the ordinary people than a group picked at random by accident of birth?

[expat]

Democracy is all well and good for the hoi poloi

Hoi polloi (οι πολλοι) with 2 lambdas. Or 2 lambadas if you prefer. No need for "the" because "οι" is the definite article. And it means "the many" so it's somewhat redundant to say that democracy is for them.

HTH

[expat]

Yes.

You think an upper house filled with career politicians owing patronage to some party leader is going to be more in touch with the ordinary people than a group picked at random by accident of birth?

Lloyd George thought so.

[threaded]

Is that the same Lloyd George who thought it a good idea to have a separate cabinet to handle the war without reference to anyone such as the prime minister, parliament etc.?

[expat]

Is that the same Lloyd George who thought it a good idea to have a separate cabinet to handle the war without reference to anyone such as the prime minister, parliament etc.?

And to create as many peers as it took to bulldoze his plans through, yes. It's not new with NL, he was a Liberal. And don't think the Tories wouldn't have done it, but they didn't need to.

[threaded]

Still doesn't make it right though.

[IR35 Avoider]

I don't want Lords elected by population as a whole - what's the point of creating a house that doesn't differ in character from the commons? The whole point of the Lords is to come at things from a different angle, to do what they think is right without caring about the opinion of anyone outside (government or voters.)

My proposal is that just before each general election MPs compete to be elected by fellow MPs to fill any seats that have fallen vacant in the Lords. If elected they have a job for life, or until officially diagnosed senile anyway. An average cross-section of MPs from all parties will do a good job if promoted to the Lords where they are free to say what they really think.

[threaded]

Oh, so senile members of the population don't get represented in your world view?

[wendigo100]

My proposal is that just before each general election MPs compete to be elected by fellow MPs to fill any seats that have fallen vacant in the Lords. If elected they have a job for life, or until officially diagnosed senile anyway. An average cross-section of MPs from all parties will do a good job if promoted to the Lords where they are free to say what they really think.

A leopard does not change its spots.

Elected politicians, by definition, get where they are by not thinking for themselves. They say what people want to hear. They obey the whips. They climb the greasy pole. They always owe patronage to somebody.

And if any elected politician ever shows signs of independent thought, that they might go against the party line occasionally, how many of their party will elect them?