Non technical people in the IT world

[threaded]

I know there are a lot of b0110ck juggling PM's out there and I understand the techies frustrations

however on the flip side if you have a task to complete - then it should be completed to the best of your ability and as quickly as possible.

On another note having a bit of fun with some techies where we are, it seems they think a server 'works' if when you turn it on the lights flash and the disk whirrs.

having trouble getting them to understand that as only they can see the lights flashing and hear the disks whirring that from everyone else point of view a server works when it actual delivers the service it is supposed to.

Can any help me out on how to get a definition of 'works' to our techy teams?

That reminds me: I had some servers at a remote locale that was flooded.

The managers repeatedly asked for them to be restarted.

Eventually I excused myself as I was laughing too hard.

So they phoned up the remote location to ask if the machine lights were on and the disks whirring.

The remote admin refused to go into the server room to check, as it was a very big room, underground, the stairwell was under 6 foot of water and it was pitch black as the electric had failed.

They asked why he didn't have a torch, and recommended a bigger back up generator.

[original PM]

a good point however lets say in the case of a MS patch

the service was delivered by the server and the software prior to the patch and therefore to say it works after the patch then you would expect that the same server delivered the same services after the patch.

And it is the server team who install the patch - if they are concerned installing the patch may affect some of the software maybe it would be useful to do a little test?

and I do have to point out that maybe it would be useful if the server team talked to the software team once in a while instead of trying to pass the blame between them selves

honestly no one really cares just make it work........

[RichardCranium]

having trouble getting them to understand that as only they can see the lights flashing and hear the disks whirring that from everyone else point of view a server works when it actual delivers the service it is supposed to.

The worst I have had lately was an applications server installed in the machine room which had no network drivers installed.

It had no network drivers because there were none for that hardware/opsys combination.

It had the hardware/opsys combination that it did because despite me having paid for a new server to be bought, someone had seen fit to reuse a 'spare' server. This server had a basic network port but the machine room uses fibre and only fibre. So someone else installed another random card instead (which also didn't do fibre). But that didn't work because there were no drivers.

So the server got put in the rack and I was told it was up and working and got the OK for the suppliers' techies to come in the next day as arranged.

I had produced signed off Product Descriptions describing that server, and had agreed some simple tests to check the server and IIS and the like were up and working OK. According to the signed off test result sheet, they managed a PING test on that server ... they later admitted did that test by pinging it from a DOS box on itself and assumed it would work when networked.

Can any help me out on how to get a definition of 'works' to our techy teams?

No. Sorry. Other than "Do it yourself".

[BoltonLad]

Even though some non tech PMs are great to work with, I had an irritating period in the past with a Non techie / No prior IT project managemnt exp - an old man who can't think anything beyond what he knows 30-35 years back.

In general,

I hate to work with Non techie PMs who can't even understand/appreciate any great work being done, speak rubbish, not at all matured and a big show off.

I always prefer a PM with technical background along with management skills.

[Julius Caesar]

If you want your software services to work, you should contact the software team, not the hardware team - who are correct when they say their server is working.

Sums it up, doesn't it? "The techies".

[Moscow Mule]

and I do have to point out that maybe it would be useful if the server team talked to the software team once in a while instead of trying to pass the blame between them selves

honestly no one really cares just make it work........

Good Hardware Team:
"We are rolling out this patch today + 4 days - it's already on this test server, test your services"
Good Software Team:
"Ok, cool, we'll test it"


Bad Hardware Team:
"..." *patches box*
Any Software Team:
"WTF did you do to the server? Our service isn't running anymore!"

[original PM]

Good Hardware Team:
"We are rolling out this patch today + 4 days - it's already on this test server, test your services"
Good Software Team:
"Ok, cool, we'll test it"


Bad Hardware Team:
"..." *patches box*
Any Software Team:
"WTF did you do to the server? Our service isn't running anymore!"

so true

must have a Bad Hardware Team!

[threaded]

Sums it up, doesn't it? "The techies".

Actually I find this artificial delineation in job functions is what causes nearly all management problems. Yet one should remember that it is the management that insist on having people specialised in one narrow area to the point where they are unable to even give a best guess about where the problem lays.

Exampe: I'm seeing adverts for T-SQL, it's like WTF: requirements for contractors specialised in writing IF statements?

[cojak]

Can any help me out on how to get a definition of 'works' to our techy teams?

<red cape, knickers over tights>

Did somebody call?

</red cape, knickers over tights>

PS - I do the same with Senior Management too, but the day rate is more..

[badger7579]

I'm taking the view from the other side. I'm a PM with a technical background and mostly work on technical projects. I don’t claim to be a techie genius (never have been) but it makes all the difference when I'm talking to my team on technical matters.

The client has some top notch techies (mix of contractors and permies) assigned to my project and they are superb. This benefits me because I have the confidence in them to do the job (don’t have to chase them all the time) and I respect their views on all technical matters and tend to default their recommendations and giving them the slack to make decisions on their own if needed.

I see my role with them as an organiser/facilitator and planner allowing them to do their job as efficiently as possible without the management of the project holding them up. They deliver on time then so do I.. A reward and recommendation for good work and hitting the deadline also goes a long way.