The real problem with Western society...

[Gonzo]

The real problem with Western society, and which could ultimately cause it's destruction, is greed & selfishness. This obsession with acumulating as much material wealth as possible, that so many people are now hooked on, is like a cancer eating away at society. We have become single minded, one-dimensional wealth-junkies, desperately trying to accumulate more than our neighbour. I was caught up in this myself for at least until the age of 30.

People are so identified with what make & model of car they drive, or how big their house is, or how posh their neighbourhood is, that they are driven to desperately try to get more money to buy a flashier car/bigger house/move to a posher neighbourhood. One wonders what will happen to their sense of identity when the full effects of this credit crunch are finally felt, and they lose said posh car/big house/posh neighbourhood. The party can't last forever. Sooner or later the bill will have to be paid by someone.

I think we have forgotton what matters in life. Sitting around counting your money, gloating over a bank statement with loads of zeros (& hopfully at least a '1' or greater digit in front of it!) is not fun. Fun comes from hanging out with friends, playing sport, watching films, enjoying music, discovering new places, being creative etc.

Are you sure you are a contractor?

[conned tractor]

Are you sure you are a contractor?

May be an agent.

[moorfield]

Yawn...

Don't start yawning. It's catching.

[norrahe]

Don't start yawning. It's catching.

YAWN

The rest is silence

[xoggoth]

I think your earlier views on religion were right. We need society based on rational assessements of what works and religious belief is only an impediment, it is a waste of the human intellect.

To an extent, religions start out as practical, they are formalisation of working rules for the tribe but they get locked into history and twisted to suit the purposes of the rulers. For example, a subordinate role of women made perfect sense in a more brutal world where physical prowess was of far greater importance, it doesn't anymore.

It is a mistake to think that only religion gives people a sense of purpose. Both China and Japan show that strong secular cultural traditions, without religious foundation, work very well.

On bankers, I find yet again that one of the most sensible arguments was in The Gaurdian, I must be going senile.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisf...-budget-report

[norrahe]

It is a mistake to think that only religion gives people a sense of purpose. Both China and Japan show that strong secular cultural traditions, without religious foundation, work very well.

Though Chinese and Japanese cultures do not have the subserviant idealism of religion that western cultures have adopted.

Their religion is part of their way of life without becoming the obstructive media that westernised religion has become if one lets it.

Christianity for some will often dictate the way they live and react (ref: catholicism, and for the record I have seen that in action in Ireland, in the way the Bishops have manipulated certain political votes via the pulpit in the past)

For may eastern religions, as a friend once said to me (he is Hindu) these are guidelines but our path is not dictated to us.

[Gonzo]

To an extent, religions start out as practical, they are formalisation of working rules for the tribe but they get locked into history and twisted to suit the purposes of the rulers. For example, a subordinate role of women made perfect sense in a more brutal world where physical prowess was of far greater importance, it doesn't anymore.

Indeed.

The example that I like to give for the same idea is that wearing clothes that completely cover the skin is a very good idea if you live in a country where the sun shines all day every day.