Speeding fines

[DimPrawn]

What's the difference between speeding when it's quiet and running a red light when there's no-one coming the other way?
They are both (Red light and speed limit) arbitary and illogical at the time of application, both illegal. If speeding's ok, why not ignore red lights at discretion?

That's the point I'm making, thanks. If you are at a junction and it says no right turn, but the road is deserted, where's the harm in turning right?

No overtaking and you are in a powerful car and can see nothing coming the other way, why the hell not?

50 mph limit and it's clear 70 will do no harm, go right ahead and put your foot down.

[Peoplesoft bloke]

That's the point I'm making, thanks. If you are at a junction and it says no right turn, but the road is deserted, where's the harm in turning right?

No overtaking and you are in a powerful car and can see nothing coming the other way, why the hell not?

50 mph limit and it's clear 70 will do no harm, go right ahead and put your foot down.

And the red light?

[DimPrawn]

And the red light?

That too.

Where's the harm in driving through red lights on empty junctions?

Lets remove speed limits and infact all rules of the road and let the people decide.

Bloody nanny state.

[Peoplesoft bloke]

I wonder if people who feel they know better about speed limits feel the same way about orangey/red traffic lights, no overtaking lines and no right/left turn signs?

Certainly the same boorish Mr Toads do, as any pedestrian trying to cross on the green man in any major city, or anyone actually observing temp lights can tell you

[NickNick]

This is the same police force (South Wales) that put the cameras out during the RAC Rally ... and sent the fines to the competitors. Not just between stretches (where rally drivers have always speeded) but the actual race sections.

Safety. Yeah. Right.

It's just another tax.

I'd love to read about that, but I can't seem to find it anywhere. All I can see is that fans and competitors were handed tickets when travelling above the speed limit between stages.

"South Wales Police again used mobile speed cameras during last weekend's event to catch speeding competitors and fans. Magistrates handed out fines totalling £7,350 yesterday and deducted a total of 57 penalty points. McRae and Burns were each fined £150 and received three points on their licences.
The timed special stages are held on private roads or Forestry Commission land, but competitors have to use public roads between stages."

and
"According to FIA reasoning, the use of speed cameras along some of the routes used by competitors and fans during both the 2002 and 2003 events suggests that some of the roads making up the non-competitive sections are too dangerous for use, thereby putting the event in jeopardy."

And
Britain's Colin McRae and Richard Burns were also among a total of 17 rally drivers caught by the roadside cameras , apparently set up to trap spectators. A total of 2,312 speeding offences were recorded, most of them involving fans driving between stages.

All I can see here is reference to the fact that people were speeding on public roads past signed speed cameras and were caught. No mention of them being caught on camera during the actuall race sections. Can you point me at anything about that?

[RichardCranium]

I'd love to read about that, but I can't seem to find it anywhere.

I know, I'm trying to find a link.

It was a fuss in the local paper that dragged on for a while.

The tickets were issued; the expectation was that the competitors would appeal. It had dawned on the powers-that-be that they could have either turned off the cameras or manually filtered out the inappropriate fines but that was too much effort. It was that I was alluding to.

Some of the roads between sections were closed to the public; only competitors were allowed onto them. The competitors were told they would be expected to pay the fines accumulated on those closed roads.

I remember it because there was a second row also that as competitors entered the country, they were being presented with their speeding fines from the previous year and not allowed in until they coughed up. They were grizzling because no other country does this. Some had threatened not to enter in future years.

[Beefy198]

Some of the roads between sections were closed to the public; only competitors were allowed onto them. The competitors were told they would be expected to pay the fines accumulated on those closed roads.

Devil's advocate: just because the road is closed to the public (i.e. other motor vehicles) does that instantly make it safe and nullify all other hazards?

[pzz76077]

Anybody know how to wrangle out of them?

Either me or my wife (using one car last week) have been caught ripping up the roads doing 40 in a 30 on a local dual carriageway. Wife has already got 6points - all 40mph on a 30mph road.

Although if travelling in the opposite direction of the same road the speed limit is 40 mph - and 30 mph in the direction with the speed camera - which confuses the hell out of you anyhow.

Am totally pee'd off with being "fined", "taxed", "robbed", call it what you will, more and more by this tuliphole government and made feel like a bloody criminal.

So has anybody here tried to wrangle out of them?

Easy one- get someone with a foreign license to take the rap for you, they will get a fine (that you will reimburse them with + a bit extra for their trouble) but it is not possible to get points put on their license.

Everyone is happy!

PZZ

[expat]

I wonder why people think it's their god given right to break this law and not others?

God given right?

Hmm. What does God have to do with it? Come to think of it, why do the police and the courts think it's their god given right to take money from people who drive faster thatn a certain speed?

Seriously: from where do they derive that right? Is it a right? Or is it just a power? You know, like where a mugger doesn't have the right to your wallet, but he has the power, so he gets it.

[expat]

That too.

Where's the harm in driving through red lights on empty junctions?

Lets remove speed limits and infact all rules of the road and let the people decide.

Bloody nanny state.

The problem is that all of these laws are misguided, in a literal sense. They are intended to stop dangerous driving (or at least that is the justifiable intention) but instead of enforcing a law against dangerous driving, the authorities make and enforce laws against particular actions, with no regard to the danger or otherwise of any particular action.

There is a law against dangerous driving, but it's a lot easier to enforce a law against speeding or disobeying road signs or running red lights. It is not as just, but it is easier.

IMHO the considered actions of a reasonable person should not make him a criminal. In all other fields of the law that is true. Only in motoring law can a reasonable person performing an act which he has considered sensibly and unselfishly and which he correctly judged to be free of risk, find himself a criminal.