Another what would you do ?

[wendigo100]

Dunno if I'd be describing a 17 yr old as a child. It's some-one's child yes, but I think 17 year old are perfectly capable of making there own minds up on a wide range of things.

Yeah, that's when I took up smoking and joined the Young Socialists!

Most 17 year olds at school know little about life outside school, which reduces how informed they are about the decisions they make.

Not every 17-year-old is as level-headed as Wayne Rooney was.

[NotAllThere]

The big difference between alcohol and illegal drugs is that the organisations that provide the market in the latter case are staffed by criminals (unless you are buying cheap alcohol from the booze smugglers). So, next time you're a victim of crime, remember how much fun you had at that party where you took a little coke.

[tay]

there are more than 2 camps here, those who have an addiction but are in denial, those who dabbled in their youth and those who hate all drugs.

Isnt that 3?

And I am in none of them. I dont hate drugs, I just dont see the advantages outweighing the negatives. Too many people in society lack the confidence required and cover inferiority complexes with drugs/alcohol.

[tay]

I know a couple of doctors, a partner in a law firm, and partner in an accountancy firm etc. All taken, or take, all normal and ok.

Depends on how well you know them, and if you have a time machine to see how things pan out long term. Besides.. whats 'normal'?

[snaw]

I don't care which camp you are in, but to promote them or call them harmless is plain stupid.

Fair point - I wouldn't say drugs are harmless. I would say almost anything, taken in excess is harmful, and you're correct to point out that the illegal nature of drugs introduces uncontrolled elemements, which are inherently risky. But like I said before - in my experience, no one died, no one bacame a hooker, very very few developed any kind of serious problems, almost everyone had fun. Most of the bad things I've ever read or heard abut involve heroin, or crack. I don't personally know anyone who wnet down that track, and I know a lot of people who've dabbled (Christ, half my department seems to, and talk openly about it, and in my age group in London I'd say it's the norm to have tried, not the other way round).

[wendigo100]

I've known several engineers and other professionals who were heavy smokers, and some heavy drinkers. All seemed pretty normal to me too.

[snaw]

Depends on how well you know them, and if you have a time machine to see how things pan out long term. Besides.. whats 'normal'?

My point it to point out that there are no stereotypes. People you'd least expect to actually do. None of them really do any more (I know most of them very well), point being that actually I'd say that is the 'norm' for most people who've socially taken drugs. Things turn out ok for most people, from what I've personally experienced.

[tay]

Well you are the expert in your personal experiences.
My personal experience is that I always know the cokers in an office, because they are complete ass clowns on a Wednesday, and it is annoying.
Moody bastards.

[Bagpuss]

Fair point - I wouldn't say drugs are harmless. I would say almost anything, taken in excess is harmful, and you're correct to point out that the illegal nature of drugs introduces uncontrolled elemements, which are inherently risky. But like I said before - in my experience, no one died, no one bacame a hooker, very very few developed any kind of serious problems, almost everyone had fun. Most of the bad things I've ever read or heard abut involve heroin, or crack. I don't personally know anyone who wnet down that track, and I know a lot of people who've dabbled (Christ, half my department seems to, and talk openly about it, and in my age group in London I'd say it's the norm to have tried, not the other way round).

I personally knew two people who have died and both were around the age of this girl, I know nobody who has died from alcohol certainly no one who did not make old bones first, and given the abudance of alcohol taking compared with drugs, I can only conclude that drugs are not harmless but I would have thought that was obvious. When you are young and foolish you take risks, but you need to be at least informed of the risk you are taking. Take for example E, deemed to be harmless (and it's nowhere near as noxious as coke), it's only now that the extent of the brain damge it causes is coming to light. It's one thing taking a risk, it's another to think it's not even risky behaviour and is perfectly safe, it isn't.

[SallyAnne]

This is a child Sally, you seem to have no problem with children taking drugs, I suspect your attitude would change if you had a child. The attitude of a little Charlie is fine could lead to a little Heroin is probably OK. Yes some people may dabble, but it is not harmless. Coke is an addictive drug and children do not have the life experience to handle addiction. I have seen people fall into downward spirals from thinking they can handle such things, if not there would be no such thing as a coke addict. Add to this the destruction of life that has lead to this little hit, drug dealers are nasty people and the people who control them are even worse, people have died been maimed or exploited for that little hit. My best friends daughter started to dabble at a young age and now she is dead. Just because you live somewhere where drugs are rife does not mean it is normal.
Or maybe you will be giving your daughter a lift down to the red light district when she needs to fund her habit (if you think that shocking have a think about what you have said)

Ah here we go.

We're having a discussion here bagpuss - lots of people have the same views as me, and the fact that you're just singling me out suggests that you actually just want to make it personal, and are incapable of having a proper debate with grown ups.

a) I would never call a 17 year old a child. That's ridiculous.
b) yes my attitude would change completely if it was my kid - I would probably turn into a complete over-protective mam. I hope not, but I probably would. I wouldn't want my kids taking drugs, or drinking, or riding the bus, certainly not driving, wouldn't really be happy with them going to uni, dating would be out...need I go on? There's a difference between acting the way your heart tells you (i.e. normal parental instincts) and listening to your head.
c) never ever woudl my attitude change to "a little heroin is ok". Ever. End of.
d) Drugs are no more rife in the north east (with the exception of Middlesborough) than anywhere else in the country. Dont kid yourself -a "child" can get hold of drugs at ever single school in this country, probably at age 11.
e) "maybe you will be giving your daughter a lift down to the red light district when she needs to fund her habit" why can't you just use your common sense and listen to what I am saying for once? There's a massive difference between using a party drug sensibly, and being "on drugs" to the extent where you'd have to sell your body to fund the habit. Can't you get this? Are you really that moronic?