Doom: Schools falling down

[edison]

This whole issue is yet another illustration of how aging and creaking our national infrastructure is including hospitals, roads, railways, water and sewage, power generation, airports etc.

It's hard to think of any part of our infrastructure that seems fit for the 21st century.

[dsc]

When I was at school in the late 70s to mid-80s, there were lots of pre-fab 'huts' which had been built as temporary classrooms. My kids schools still had some of these recently. I'm sure lots of schools still have them.

Some of our local schools are still like this, like a bloody temporary accommodation you set up for a building site, although even those portacabins building sites use are much nicer and modern looking.

I'm always amazed why there's nothing new being build in the UK, no new schools, no hospitals, everything seems like a temp solution which is then used for 20+ years. Ran down and falling apart seems to be the norm and fits well as a description of this country.

[DoctorStrangelove]

Of course there's something new: HS2. .

[SueEllen]

I guess if it was used in the 50s it wasn't so long after the war and money was very tight. Something was better than nothing but the planners probably thought that these buildings or at least the roofs perhaps, would be replaced within three to four decades.

When I was at school in the late 70s to mid-80s, there were lots of pre-fab 'huts' which had been built as temporary classrooms. My kids schools still had some of these recently. I'm sure lots of schools still have them.

The schools around me were renovated or rebuilt under Blair's government. Though the primary school and some other schools were actually built in the Victorian era.

[alphadog]

I suspect that the classrooms/hospitals identified to date are just the tip of the iceberg. The work that will be required going forward to rectify this is going to take multiple decades to resolve.

If we are notified that our kids school has it, we'll be looking for another school. Years of disruption await for those affected (starting with a forest of scaffold poles in the classrooms, followed by possible asbestos exposure, temporary classrooms during construction, etc) versus making a new group of friends at a young age, we'll take the latter.

It's not just RAAC concrete that needs to be replaced/strengthened. Bridges and viaducts up and down the country are past their use by date, as are many tower blocks. Remember how close the Hammersmith flyover came to pinging itself to a spectacular end... https://www.newcivilengineer.com/lat...se-28-11-2019/

Not to mention masonry facades/parapets/chimneys all over the country which are hanging on by a wing and a prayer, uninspected and unmonitored, no one seems to care.

I guess one of the problems is the economics of repair/replacement are very ugly. No one wants to spend a tonne of money to end up with essentially the same thing that you had before.

[edison]

I suspect that the classrooms/hospitals identified to date are just the tip of the iceberg. The work that will be required going forward to rectify this is going to take multiple decades to resolve.

If we are notified that our kids school has it, we'll be looking for another school. Years of disruption await for those affected (starting with a forest of scaffold poles in the classrooms, followed by possible asbestos exposure, temporary classrooms during construction, etc) versus making a new group of friends at a young age, we'll take the latter.

It's not just RAAC concrete that needs to be replaced/strengthened. Bridges and viaducts up and down the country are past their use by date, as are many tower blocks. Remember how close the Hammersmith flyover came to pinging itself to a spectacular end... https://www.newcivilengineer.com/lat...se-28-11-2019/

Not to mention masonry facades/parapets/chimneys all over the country which are hanging on by a wing and a prayer, uninspected and unmonitored, no one seems to care.

I guess one of the problems is the economics of repair/replacement are very ugly. No one wants to spend a tonne of money to end up with essentially the same thing that you had before.

There's almost no political capital to be gained from investing in large, quality, built to last infrastructure projects. Politicians who sanction projects are usually long gone by the time the new thing is falling apart or needs replacing. Do it on the cheap or make do and mend is the mantra. Except for projects in London and the SE of course, where we get billions invested in HS1, HS2, Crossrail etc.

Aside from those high profile transport projects, the treasury always seems to keep a very tight rein on capital spending and due to historic rules, it has generally favoured projects in the South East. Hopefully that will change.

[vetran]

Sadly politics and 4 year terms mean the sitting government won't build for the future.
The opposition won't hold the Government to account for bodging it because they will point out the opposition were just as bad.

Everything costs too much because once the government gets involved the invoice gets padded.

[SueEllen]

Sadly politics and 4 year terms mean the sitting government won't build for the future.
The opposition won't hold the Government to account for bodging it because they will point out the opposition were just as bad.

Labour hasn't been in power for 13 years.

I suspect the Tories didn't realise they would be in power so long due to Labour electing an unelectable party leader. Hence they thought everything would fall down while Labour were back in power.

Everything costs too much because once the government gets involved the invoice gets padded.

Government working practices don't help.

[vetran]

Labour hasn't been in power for 13 years.

I suspect the Tories didn't realise they would be in power so long due to Labour electing an unelectable party leader. Hence they thought everything would fall down while Labour were back in power.



Government working practices don't help.

The RAAC danger was known in the 1980s so we can blame it on Blue, Red & yellow. Scotland & Wales will have their hand out so we can expand the list of colours.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/...e%20demolished.


Agree the government procurement and management practices are severely lacking.

[vetran]

sorted